Home News Buyers Guide About Advertising
 
 
 
   
Results 1 to 10 of 10
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    8

    Calibration and profiles

    I have a new Panasonic Lumix DMC-FZ20 camera and am using iView MediaPro on a Mac with OS X 10.3.

    The photographs will be viewed only on screen, either in iView or in a browser. Some will be used on a web site and viewed on the internet with whatever monitor the user has.

    I have no idea what I should do about color profiles, calibration and such. Years ago, when I did some DTP work with a scanner and a commercial printer I went through rough waters with ColorSync, scanner calibrations, screen calibrations, and surprises with the printer. I don't have fond memories of that time because although I read heaps of documentation on the subject, I never got the feeling I knew what I was doing.

    So now, I'm again in the dark. The camera doesn't come with any profile as far as I could see. None to be found on the Panasonic site either. When I connect the camera to the Mac and call up ColorSync utility, it shows a "Factory Profile" named "Camera RGB Profile" which is obviously the default system profile and not one that is specific to the camera.

    When I import the images into iView, I can either embed a ColorSync profile or not. If I do, the default Camera RGB Profile is embedded; if I don't, a sRGB IE61966-2.1 profile is embedded instead.

    I have no idea why I should choose one or the other. From my experience, there should be a specific camera profile for the whole setup to make sense to me, but since there isn't, I don't know what to do or why.

    I have calibrated my monitor with the Displays system utility using Gamma 2.2 and white point 6500 which I gathered from some reading here is what I should use. The result is that my monitor screen is much darker that what I'm used to. But that is also what I got years ago when I calibrated my monitor using a hardware calibrator. The photographs are better on screen though with the calibration than without.

    I don't even know if there is any point to all this, especially for viewing on the web, although it does appear some browsers are aware of the embedded profile.

    Any work on the images will be done in PhotoShop 7 (haven't gotten around to upgrading to CS). Until now, when working strictly for internet viewing, I've done everything without any color management whatsoever.

    Thanks for any help.

    Ellen

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    8
    Why aren't you editing your fotos in Photoshop?
    You can edit and apply a different coloysync profile.
    Peace

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    8
    The question is: what profile should I embed if any, and why?

    Since I can embed a profile when importing the images from the camera into iView, it is better to embed the right profile at that time so as not to have to do extra work later.

    Ellen

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    8
    You would need to calibrate your computer system, printer, scanner, monitor if you intend for your fotos to be printed by some one else.

    Say working in Quarkxpress or Indesign. You've created a layout that you would send out to press, (offset printed), if you already have a printing shop in mind to use, you could ask them for their Colorsync monitor and proofing device profiles. Once installed on your computer, then you'll have something close to What You See is What You Get. This would be more like "soft proofing" from only your monitor or a postscript compactable printer.

    If you are very concerned about veiwing them on screen and printing them accurately to your own photo printer (Canon, Epson or HP) you would have to create profiles so that your monitor and printer output match.

    You may need to purchase additional software for your Mac to proper calibrate both your monitor and printer.

    Pro photographers needing gallery quality or poster size prints offen work with a service bureau/print shop for consistent results.

    Hope this helps.
    Peace

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    71

    Calibration and Profiles

    Quote Originally Posted by EllenH
    I have a new Panasonic Lumix DMC-FZ20 camera and am using iView MediaPro on a Mac with OS X 10.3.

    So now, I'm again in the dark. The camera doesn't come with any profile as far as I could see. None to be found on the Panasonic site either. When I connect the camera to the Mac and call up ColorSync utility, it shows a "Factory Profile" named "Camera RGB Profile" which is obviously the default system profile and not one that is specific to the camera.
    ColorSync is going to show you a generic RGB profile that is similar to sRGB but with a gamma of 1.8. It's not terribly useful, nor is it specific to your camera. If you import images through Image Capture you may see that your images have a "panasonic camera" profile attached to it. I believe that this profile is a slight variant on the Camera RGB profile.

    Quote Originally Posted by EllenH
    When I import the images into iView, I can either embed a ColorSync profile or not. If I do, the default Camera RGB Profile is embedded; if I don't, a sRGB IE61966-2.1 profile is embedded instead.

    I have no idea why I should choose one or the other. From my experience, there should be a specific camera profile for the whole setup to make sense to me, but since there isn't, I don't know what to do or why.

    I have calibrated my monitor with the Displays system utility using Gamma 2.2 and white point 6500 which I gathered from some reading here is what I should use. The result is that my monitor screen is much darker that what I'm used to. But that is also what I got years ago when I calibrated my monitor using a hardware calibrator. The photographs are better on screen though with the calibration than without.

    I don't even know if there is any point to all this, especially for viewing on the web, although it does appear some browsers are aware of the embedded profile.

    Any work on the images will be done in PhotoShop 7 (haven't gotten around to upgrading to CS). Until now, when working strictly for internet viewing, I've done everything without any color management whatsoever.

    Thanks for any help.

    Ellen
    Based on your intended output, there isn't a lot of color management work that you can do. Profiling digital cameras is very difficult unless you are shooting in controlled studio lighting and the internet is basically without any color management support.

    My recommendation would be this: Use sRGB for your digital camera images as this will be a best possible match for images on the internet. You may want to invest in a colorimeter and software package that can profile your displays. While the Apple Display Calibrator is better than nothing, it isn't terribly accurate. The next thing that you might want to look into if your camera can shoot in the raw mode is the Calibrate tab in Photoshop CS. This allows you to create a series of settings that describes how your camera captures color and tone. This setting is then applied as the default setting for your raw captures and significantly improves the speed of your workflow.

    I think that you are on the right path. I would suggest performing all of your color management in Photoshop and avoiding Apple's software for color management as these programs behave in unpredictable, and sometimes counterintuitive ways.

    Best of luck,

    Jay Kinghorn
    RGB Imaging

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    8
    I haven't seen any Panasonic profiles appear when using Image Capture. I'll leave the sRGB IE61966-2.1 that gets embedded by iView since it seems the most appropriate.

    The DMC-FZ20 doesn't do RAW, only TIFF. Does this make a difference?

    Thanks for the advice.

    Ellen

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Los Altos, CA
    Posts
    2,635

    RE: Calibration and profiles

    Ellen, it's my (perhaps ignorant?) impression that profiles are generally created to match printer output to what is seen on the monitor. For example, I use a ColorVision Spyder which tests my monitor, and generates a profile, which is then used by ColorSync whenever I need to print on my Epson 2200. So far, it seems to be working very well; when I edit my Panasonic photos in PhotoShop, I always choose to keep the embedded profile, and edit from there. Results seem fine that way, but there does seem to be some "black art" going on in making the matchup!
    Let a be your umbrella!

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    71

    Calibration and Profiles

    Ellen,

    There is a difference between RAW and TIFF camera formats. The raw mode allows you to adjust the image's exposure, white balance, saturation and contrast before the image is processed into a TIFF or JPEG. It sounds to me like your best option is to shoot JPEGs, leave them in sRGB and use IView for your editing.

    John,
    A color managed workflow uses an ICC profile to describe the color behavior of each device in the workflow plus one intermediate color space. (Usually Photoshop's working space:sRGB or Adobe 1998). When you build your monitor profile using the ColorVision Spyder, that information is stored at the operating system level and is used by all of your ICC-aware programs (Photoshop, Preview, Iphoto and even Mail.) You don't ever want to choose your monitor profile in Photoshop. This basically guarantees that your files will not print correctly if you send them to a lab, and makes it more difficult for you to effectively tone and color-correct your images. You definately don't want to choose your monitor profile as your RGB working space!

    A note about the Spyder. To get a good calibration/profile, you need to use it in a dark room. Any ambient light will skew the readings and make the resulting profile less accurate.

    Best regards,

    Jay Kinghorn
    RGB Imaging

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Posts
    8
    Jay,

    What would you recommend when opening the JPEG or TIFF files in PhotoShop? I use a custom setting with RGB working space set to sRGB IEC61966-2.1.

    And if I stick to the sRGB settings for the web, what would I need to do if I wanted to print?

    When would you recommend setting it to "ColorSync workflow"?

    Thanks.

    Ellen

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    71

    Calibration and Profiles

    Quote Originally Posted by EllenH
    Jay,

    What would you recommend when opening the JPEG or TIFF files in PhotoShop? I use a custom setting with RGB working space set to sRGB IEC61966-2.1.
    I recommend that you set your color management policies to "preserve embedded profile" and continue to use sRGB.

    Quote Originally Posted by EllenH
    And if I stick to the sRGB settings for the web, what would I need to do if I wanted to print?
    You would use the either the printer's color management to make the conversion from sRGB to "printer RGB", or do it manually in the Print WIth Preview menu in Photoshop.

    Quote Originally Posted by EllenH
    When would you recommend setting it to "ColorSync workflow"?
    Never. Unless of course I was trying to drive myself stark raving mad.
    If you have Adobe products, do everything you can to steer clear of ColorSync and Quartz filters.

    Best regards,
    Jay Kinghorn
    RGB Imaging

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •