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  1. #11
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    i've not heard of that issue before, does this contact point issue occur with all your glass ? when you say auto modes, are you talking about P and scene modes or even semi auto ? as for light meters...lol i've not used a light meter since film.
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  2. #12
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    Thumbs down Oops ... CRASH!!!

    So, you have to run back and forth with your Nikon Camera (no matter what lens you are using) to get incident light measurements, right? Sounds dicey! $3000 camera and lens combo hitting the deck when the darn neckstrap gets caught ... over a $500 LM

    Hey, we all play it one way or ANOTHER ... still, I use the method I was taught and it works.

    Let's face it ...there are still people out there swearing by their P&S Cameras as the "be all/end all" solution to photography. I don't even know where to begin addressing that line of thinking.

    It was my Sekonic 558R Light Meter that told me that my Canon EOS-3 metering was shot to hell! Wound up having to get that fixed ... but, with the handheld Light Meter, I was still able to shoot it in MANUAL ... Jekostas.
    Last edited by DonSchap; 07-29-2009 at 03:30 PM.
    Don Schap - BFA, Digital Photography
    A Photographer Is Forever
    Look, I did not create the optical laws of the Universe ... I simply learned to deal with them.
    Remember: It is usually the GLASS, not the camera (except for moving to Full Frame), that gives you the most improvement in your photography.

    flickr & Sdi

  3. #13
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    what are you talking about ?? ae you serious here or is this a wind up ?

    i dont have to run anywhere. i just use a spot meter. that's what its there for, i tap my little button and my eyes never leave the VF. short of that, take a shot with your best estimate then make your slight adjustments. how often do you use a lightmeter Don ? i mean really...this is moving into the realm of the compeltely and utterly ridiculous. i smell something and the odour isnt pleasant...
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  4. #14
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    Lightbulb Studio work and multi-light source scenarios

    Setting up strobes is a calculation nightmare for backgrounds and subjects. I can just see you wasting time flashing your system, strapped to your tripod and spot metering. The LM allows you to get right in there, get your degrees of light in the setup and then reduce the number of shots ... to get it right. Agreed, it is more helpful in using film, because film is expensive, but still ... there is a level to which you can only get with your DSLR TTL metering.

    It they didn't work ... they could not sell them, my friend. If you opt to not use one ... that does not mean you are doing it right.

    I ask you: If a tripod falls over with your rig on it, in a forest ... and there is no one around to hear it, do you not make a sound when you return to it?
    Last edited by DonSchap; 07-29-2009 at 03:39 PM.
    Don Schap - BFA, Digital Photography
    A Photographer Is Forever
    Look, I did not create the optical laws of the Universe ... I simply learned to deal with them.
    Remember: It is usually the GLASS, not the camera (except for moving to Full Frame), that gives you the most improvement in your photography.

    flickr & Sdi

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by DonSchap View Post
    Setting up strobes is a calculation nightmare for backgrounds and subjects. I can just see you wasting time flashing your system, strapped to your tripod and spot metering. The LM allows you to get right in there, get your degrees of light in the setup and then reduce the number of shots ... to get it right. Agreed, it is more helpful in using film, because film is expensive, but still ... there is a level to which you can only get with your DSLR TTL metering.

    It they didn't work ... they could not sell them, my friend. If you opt to not use one ... that does not mean you are doing it right.

    I ask you: If a tripod falls over with your rig on it, in a forest ... and there is no one around to hear it, do you not make a sound when you return to it?
    are you talking about using a light meter for ambient light ? you are confusing the heck out of yourself i think.
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  6. #16
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    Red face A lesson in lighting?

    If you choose not to use a light meter, that's fine. Get your shot however you decide ... you are the artist. They use to sketch it out of thin air ... before Nikon, right?

    When I am mixing strobes ... I need to know just how much I am getting from each one for the final exposure. It has nothing to do with ambient light. LOL The studio is effectively DARK (-4 Ev).

    An important concept to understand when dealing with studio lighting for portrait photography is contrast. Contrast is the difference in the amount of light that falls on the dark areas of a scene and the amount of light that falls on the highlight areas of a scene. aAs you are well aware, human beings can see a wide range of contrast while film and digital capture devices are much more limited in the light level ranges that they can record. For this reason, we must use caution when lighting a scene, and consider the ratio of the amount of light between light and dark areas or the Lighting Ratio.

    Due to the latitude of film and digital sensors, it is the photographer’s goal to find the exposure that strikes the appropriate balance between the highlights and shadows. You must begin by deciding the desired “feel” of the final image. If you wish to obscure shadow detail and draw attention to the subject, high contrast lighting may be most appropriate. On the other hand, you may wish to show detail in both the highlight and shadow areas which would require lower contrast lighting. Once you know the effect you wish to obtain, you can begin to identify the proper lighting ratio for the shoot. This is precisely where the light meter plays its role.

    The definition of a proper lighting ratio is very subjective and can vary widely between photographers. There are, however, several lighting ratios commonly used in commercial portrait photography that offer some assistance to illustrate the process for determining this ratio ... in the studio setting. For example, a lighting ratio of 4:1 is common for traditional portraits. A 4:1 ratio indicates that there is four times (or two stops) more light in the highlight areas of the face than in the shadow areas. A 4:1 ratio gives enough light in the shadows that details can be seen, while creating the sense of depth required for realism.

    To produce a portrait with a 4:1 lighting ratio, you would begin by determining the exposure values for the main light. Let’s assume for this example that there is a main light and a fill reflector. The main light is off camera right at 45 degrees and the fill reflector is off camera left at a similar angle. Remove the fill reflector and take an exposure with only the main. Use an incident light meter to measure the amount of light that falls on the side of the face nearest the light (You cannot "spot-meter" incident light ... only reflected light). Anyway, this value will give you the "working aperture" for the shot. In other words, this exposure value (Ev) is set such that you get proper exposure in the highlight area of the subject’s face. Now, add the reflector back into the scene and take another exposure. This time, use the light meter to record the exposure value for the light falling on the shadow side of the face. The ratio between these two values should be 1:4 or two stops. So, if the highlight side of the face registered f/8 and the shadow side registered f/4, you have achieved the proper ratio. If you do not get f/4 in the shadow side, simply move the reflector forward or backward to compensate taking a new reading each time you move it. Yes, 'Rooz', since you have decided to "knowingly" not use a handheld light meter ... this entails move your silly expensive camera & lens (whoops!) ... and taking the reading (each time).

    When the reflector or second light is placed such that fill light can spill into the highlight areas, extra caution must be used to calculate the resulting ratio. Be sure to measure highlights again and recalculate the ratio after adding a second light or reflector.

    Below is a chart that will help illustrate some of the common light ratios and what they mean in terms of f stop differences. As you can see, a rule of thumb is that to calculate ratio, using stop difference, take 2 and raise to the power of the stop difference.

    Common Lighting Ratios

    Ratio . . . Stops Difference . . . Description
    1:1 . . . . . No Difference . . . . . Flat lighting
    2:1 . . . . . 1 Stop . . . . . . . . . General color photography
    3:1 . . . . . 1 1/2 Stops . . . . . General black & white photography
    4:1 . . . . . 2 Stops . . . . . . . . Dramatic lighting, low key
    8:1 . . . . . 3 Stops . . . . . . . . Very dramatic, low key

    Who says modern photography isn't a blast? Are you feeling enlightened, yet, 'Rooz'? Not so ... corn-fused? Besides, this seems a little "off-topic."
    Last edited by DonSchap; 07-29-2009 at 04:44 PM.
    Don Schap - BFA, Digital Photography
    A Photographer Is Forever
    Look, I did not create the optical laws of the Universe ... I simply learned to deal with them.
    Remember: It is usually the GLASS, not the camera (except for moving to Full Frame), that gives you the most improvement in your photography.

    flickr & Sdi

  7. #17
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    i think he was referring to Creative Styles like Vivid, Standard etc...
    Canon EOS 7D

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  8. #18
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    goodness me...far too many numbers and calculations there for my little brain. thats from the dim dark ages when things far too complex and terribly boring. i dont do any of that. not ever.

    i've never run around with my camera taking light readings. neevr used a meter to take light readings. never moved an inch. if i shoot in CLS, i adjust it on cam. if i shoot in manual flash i adjust strobes as i shoot/ chimp/ shoot. no need for complex ratios and calcualtions and all that other nonsense. no rules, no numbers. i rely on my eyes which are far more accurate tools than some crusty old book and a calculator. by the time you;ve got all your claulations right, i've already go the shot, packed up and having a beer.

    as i've suggested to you before, i think you really need to read mcnally, hobby, jarvis and anyone else over at strobist. you're making things awfully difficult and complex for yourself.
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  9. #19
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    Jul 2008
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    Simple question Don; long, rambling, and many times completely patronizing answer.
    I'm not an idiot. I shot with manual SLRs for years and years, I know how to use a light meter, I know how to shoot fully manual, and no, I've never used a scene mode in my life.

    HOWEVER

    I find it damned ridiculous that you continually spend thousands and thousands on flashes, meters, bodies, lenses etc. and then second-guess them at every turn.

    Great falconer's glove, by the way.
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  10. #20
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    Chimp? Yeah ... that's the artist of the new millennia, for sure. A P&S Groupie. I swear, digital has turned you into a simple person, 'Rooz.' It leads one to ask, "Do you use your head for more than a hat rack or simply a location to place your camera's viewfinder against?"

    I honestly do not believe if you told people during a professional interview that you simply shoot the image, over and over, until it looks right that you would get hired. I would hazard to say that most models would walk out on you, by you doing that kind of thing.

    That may be "okay" in a non-professional environment, where time is not money ... but, like I stated earlier in this thread ... just because you do it that way, DOES NOT MAKE IT RIGHT.

    You are putting bad advice out there ... and that should stop. "Cheating the system" still is an unacceptable practice. We need to get back to basics ... not smear them. I am disappointed.
    Last edited by DonSchap; 07-29-2009 at 04:57 PM.
    Don Schap - BFA, Digital Photography
    A Photographer Is Forever
    Look, I did not create the optical laws of the Universe ... I simply learned to deal with them.
    Remember: It is usually the GLASS, not the camera (except for moving to Full Frame), that gives you the most improvement in your photography.

    flickr & Sdi

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