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  1. #61
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Monmouthshire, UK
    Posts
    2,152
    Sean, you're basically right about the sharpness.
    Noise reduction processing (in or out of camera) reduces detail. It's a trade off, cleaner image, sharper detail. The camera processor uses software algorithms to do the business and it looks like Canikon, with the benefit of experience seem to have a better s/w algorithm than Sony at this time.We all hope it changes.
    In fact both the 1600 and 3200 shots have reduced detail but I agree, the 3200 looks better because of the reduction in noise. Actually, I think both pics are an improvement, it's just more obvious at ISO 3200.
    I could have played around a little more by applying an unsharp mask, but I chose not to as I think the point had been made.

    At this point I should make it clear that I only installed Noise Ninja today and It's likely that an expert will get a better result. It's may also be possible to get a better result by turning off "High Iso Noise Reduction" (available with v4 firmware) combined with proper use of Noise Ninja; beyond my small skills at this point in time.

    On a broader note I have to say that 90% of my stuff is done below ISO800 where the Sony is, in any case, the equal of the competition. I'm now pretty happy that the combination of anti shake, "push processing" and Noise Ninja will deliver the goods should I feel the need to go to higher ISO's.

  2. #62
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Raleigh, NC, USA
    Posts
    788
    I mentioned that I went into a local Wolf today to play with the A700. As far as I can tell, this one Wolf (there are a ton in Raleigh) is the only one that has an A700 on hand. The person working there also told me they don't carry it anymore... which I found odd. She seemed to think the A900 was the replacement, which I knew wasn't true. She was fairly knowledgeable about other stuff. I talked to her a bit about the high ISO of some of the other cameras in the range, and she seemed to think that the D90 was the best, but only by a slight margin over the 40/50D. She was really pushing the 50D (either because she is trying to justify buying one personally, or because it was what they had in stock) which is funny because _most_ things I have read say that the 50D isn't quite as good at higher ISOs as the 40D, but it is probably splitting hairs.

    At the ~$1000 price point, I really like the feel of the Canon xxD better than the A700 or the D90. Maybe a D300 would feel better, but I haven't tried one, and certainly couldn't afford one. The A700 was surprisingly light, which is a benefit in some cases. But the xxD just kinda fit in my hand better, and felt solid. This is really going to be a tough decision.

    _If_ I do switch systems, can I still hang out here???
    Jason Hamilton
    Selective Frame

    EOS 5D - Canon EF 24-85mm f/3.5-4.5 USM, EF 35 f/2, EF 50mm f/1.8 Mk II, EF 70-210 f/3.5-4.5 USM, EF 85mm f/1.8 USM, EF 100mm f/2.8 Macro, Helios 44-2 58mm f/2 (with EOS adapter), 430EX, Canon S90
    Nikon FE - Nikkor 35mm f/2 AI'd, Nikkor 50mm f/1.8 AI, Nikkor 105mm f/2.5 AI, F to EF adapter, 2xVivitar 285, other lighting stuff
    Mamiya C220 - 80mm f/2.8

    Gear List flickr

  3. #63
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Guelph, Ontario
    Posts
    1,903
    the 40D felt awesome in my hands when i held it.
    the D90 has slightly better high iso images even compared to the D300. just slightly.
    for around 1k, the best buy would be the D90 body but you really need to hold a D300. it feels awesome. and i believe the D300 is capable of 8fps with a VC.
    not sure if the A700 gets faster with the VC and extra battery though.
    Canon EOS 7D

    flickr
    FLUIDR

  4. #64
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    2,132
    The things the D300 has over the D90 are burst rate, ergonomics, weather sealed body around a magnesium frame, controls, buttons, customizability, viewfinder, and ability to use older lenses. There's more minor things that I can't think of at the moment.
    Nikon D300 | Tamron 17-50mm f/2.8 | Nikkor AF-S 70-300mm VR | Nikkor AF 35mm f/2 D | SB-600 | Lowepro Voyager C | Lowepro Slingshot 300 AW

    For Sale:
    Nikkor AF 35mm f/2 D - Like New (FX compatible)

    Wish List
    Nikkor AF-S 17-55 f/2.8
    Nikkor AF-S 70-200 f/4 VRII
    Tokina AF 11-16 f/2.8
    SB-900 (2)
    Umbrellas
    New Tripod

  5. #65
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Raleigh, NC, USA
    Posts
    788
    Whats the deal with the lenses? I know the D40/60 can only AF with AF-S lenses, but I read somewhere that they can work really old lenses, even ones that the D70 and some others couldn't.

    What are the different "generations" of F-mount that determine this stuff?
    Jason Hamilton
    Selective Frame

    EOS 5D - Canon EF 24-85mm f/3.5-4.5 USM, EF 35 f/2, EF 50mm f/1.8 Mk II, EF 70-210 f/3.5-4.5 USM, EF 85mm f/1.8 USM, EF 100mm f/2.8 Macro, Helios 44-2 58mm f/2 (with EOS adapter), 430EX, Canon S90
    Nikon FE - Nikkor 35mm f/2 AI'd, Nikkor 50mm f/1.8 AI, Nikkor 105mm f/2.5 AI, F to EF adapter, 2xVivitar 285, other lighting stuff
    Mamiya C220 - 80mm f/2.8

    Gear List flickr

  6. #66
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Des Plaines, IL
    Posts
    9,560

    Red face A700 Vertical Grip elaboration ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Elisha82 View Post
    Not sure if the A700 gets faster with the VG and extra battery though.
    The answer is ... Nah. Same speed on the camera w/ or w/o the VG-C70AM grip. It was not designed for that. It basically adds another battery and all the controls on the right-hand side on the camera into the 'vertical orientation', so there is no awk-weird gripping or control operation.
    Don Schap - BFA, Digital Photography
    A Photographer Is Forever
    Look, I did not create the optical laws of the Universe ... I simply learned to deal with them.
    Remember: It is usually the GLASS, not the camera (except for moving to Full Frame), that gives you the most improvement in your photography.

    flickr & Sdi

  7. #67
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Guelph, Ontario
    Posts
    1,903
    Quote Originally Posted by DonSchap View Post
    The answer is ... Nah. Same speed on the camera w/ or w/o the VG-C70AM grip. It was not designed for that. It basically adds another battery and all the controls on the right-hand side on the camera into the 'vertical orientation', so there is no awk-weird gripping or control operation.
    that's too bad. would have been a bonus if it did!
    Canon EOS 7D

    flickr
    FLUIDR

  8. #68
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Raleigh, NC, USA
    Posts
    788
    However, in my quick checks, it looks like the Sony grips (A700 and A900 only) are the only ones that offer pretty much the full set of controls available on the main body. That combined with the portrait orientation sensor and display makes a pretty sweet vertical setup.
    Jason Hamilton
    Selective Frame

    EOS 5D - Canon EF 24-85mm f/3.5-4.5 USM, EF 35 f/2, EF 50mm f/1.8 Mk II, EF 70-210 f/3.5-4.5 USM, EF 85mm f/1.8 USM, EF 100mm f/2.8 Macro, Helios 44-2 58mm f/2 (with EOS adapter), 430EX, Canon S90
    Nikon FE - Nikkor 35mm f/2 AI'd, Nikkor 50mm f/1.8 AI, Nikkor 105mm f/2.5 AI, F to EF adapter, 2xVivitar 285, other lighting stuff
    Mamiya C220 - 80mm f/2.8

    Gear List flickr

  9. #69
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Guelph, Ontario
    Posts
    1,903
    yeah i like buttons. the a300 grip does not have enough!
    Canon EOS 7D

    flickr
    FLUIDR

  10. #70
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Des Plaines, IL
    Posts
    9,560
    Oh my ... sounds like an upgrade should be scheduled in your future, 'Elisha'. When the A700 was announced ... it went straight to the pre-order list ... and shipped when available. The vertical grip came about a month later. Put together, that camera was most impressive. Even the guys down at the Canon/Nikon shoppe were a little startled to see such attention to ergonomic detail.

    As I compare the Minolta Maxxum 9000 with its BP90 and MD90 power drive stack ... and then see the A700 w/ the VG-C70AM ...

    Name:  9000-BP-MD-vs-A700-VG.jpg
Views: 42
Size:  323.2 KB

    the improvements in just the grip, alone, are awesome.
    Last edited by DonSchap; 02-23-2009 at 07:19 PM.
    Don Schap - BFA, Digital Photography
    A Photographer Is Forever
    Look, I did not create the optical laws of the Universe ... I simply learned to deal with them.
    Remember: It is usually the GLASS, not the camera (except for moving to Full Frame), that gives you the most improvement in your photography.

    flickr & Sdi

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