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  1. #21
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    My motivations to go with SONY came from, I guess three different aspects ...
    1. I already had several relatively nice lenses from my "Minolta" days
    2. Canon not putting stability in the camera body. I wrote to them and asked them to do so, but they chose to ignore my advice. Hey, I'm a paying customer ... and it's my money ... adios!
    3. Buying Canon lenses with IS in them is unbelievably expensive, for something I get "for free" in my camera body! Any lens I "strap on" ... shake shake shake ... gone!


    So, SONY gets the nod and here we is! Makes perfect sense to me.
    Last edited by DonSchap; 01-07-2009 at 07:20 PM.
    Don Schap - BFA, Digital Photography
    A Photographer Is Forever
    Look, I did not create the optical laws of the Universe ... I simply learned to deal with them.
    Remember: It is usually the GLASS, not the camera (except for moving to Full Frame), that gives you the most improvement in your photography.

    flickr & Sdi

  2. #22
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    Dec 2006
    Location
    Guelph, Ontario
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    i was never a Sony fan but was always a Minolta fan so here is is!
    plus IS is icing on the cake.
    Canon EOS 7D

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    FLUIDR

  3. #23
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    Feb 2006
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    Des Plaines, IL
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    I tell you, Elisha ... when Minolta folded ... I was crushed. I was just getting ready to make the move to digital ... and suddenly, they were gone (circa 2005). Understanding SONY had bought the entire Camera Division and the "A"mount was interesting, but I needed a camera system and like ... right now. So, I up and bought the EOS 20D, the EOS-3 and several TAMRON Canon-mount lenses. Without the SONY A100 in the picture, so to speak, to contrast it with, it was what it was. Over and over, I kept running into issues where IS was a very nice to have commodity, but the lens offerings were, as I stated, extremely pricey. Plus, not a single PRIME lens, under 200mm, had IS in it. So, in a way, it was "half-assed with half-fast glass. (f/2.8 at best)"

    Anyway, in July 2006, the A100 was released and while not a perfect camera ... it was pretty good with my existing glass. I did a lot of comparison shoots and found the "built-in-the body-stability" to be just the answer.

    When the A700 was released, it was, in my estimation, the "final solution." It simply had nearly EVERYTHING you could want in a camera body. Oh sure, they have developed some other novel features since, but when it comes to having all the basics ... YES SIR!

    So, sticking with Minolta/SONY has been the right choice. Once you have the A700 and the glass ... you are ready to rock with the big boys. Let them know you have arrived!
    Don Schap - BFA, Digital Photography
    A Photographer Is Forever
    Look, I did not create the optical laws of the Universe ... I simply learned to deal with them.
    Remember: It is usually the GLASS, not the camera (except for moving to Full Frame), that gives you the most improvement in your photography.

    flickr & Sdi

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    2,204
    Quote Originally Posted by DonSchap View Post
    I noticed that the young man had a brand new camera, the EOS XSi. As I examined his Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS lens (I had never seen the "new" one, up until then. My own experiences were only with the original version <non-IS>, back 2005. It got shelved pretty quick in favor of the TAMRON AF 18-200mm f/3.5-6.3 XR Di-II LD Aspherical (IF)), I realized that he might be able to get by if he did several things differently, but guys ... I don't have all day to explain stuff like that to Canon users. I figure, you pick your poison ... and he can go to the Canon forum and fend for himself. I'm not getting paid for my time, either, unlike that guy behind the counter.

    I mean, screwing around with you guys on here is one thing ... when it comes to real time stuff ... as our shameless Governor has been so quick to point out, it's "pay to play, Pal!" Especially with non-SONY camera toters. Like I said, I could have spent a couple hours explaining and demonstrating different results to further his understanding, but I kept looking at his camera and shaking my noggin'. Too much work. I bought my SONY to avoid these kind of problems. I had to sell all my Canon crap to pay for it and make the complete migration. I had a lot more going on than just a camera and a "kit" lens.

    I mean a 50mm f/1.4 on a SONY ... has Image Stability. On a Canon, it's got squat! You are probably right, I should have argued that he change brands before he got dug in by the cost of glass ... but, as I have found out on this FORUM, you cannot save those who do not want to listen (a lesson from ol' Noah, by God!). Would he have made the change? I doubt it. He bought his choice of camera for a reason ... I respect that (not really, but the hell with it) and I am just not going to go through a song & dance to get him to convert. Someone, several months ago, should have successfully done that when he was initially shopping for a rig ... but, he wound up with a low-end Canon and a "kit". Live with it and learn!

    If I sound bitter, I am not. Unlike our upcoming President, I just get tired of repeating myself. The message should be clear enough ... there is a lot to be said for "in-the-body-stabilization", PRIME lenses, low light and the fact that every single lens you mount enjoys the use of it. If you are too thick to appreciate that fact ... what can a I say? "See ya on the Dark Side", I guess. Oh yeah, "and bring a flash
    ."

    Welcome to the SONY DSLR forum ... where it is supposed to be fun, not more work.
    That's HYSTERICAL! ROFLLLLL! eh, you did what you could

    Quote Originally Posted by Elisha82 View Post
    the xsi is not an easy camera to work with and is pretty small compared to the alphas. My pinky had absolutely no place to go.
    Anyway long story short, my cousin wanted to get a dslr for xmas and asked me my opinion. I pimped the alpha for it's IS and told him the pros and cons of each brand. So while I was away on vacation, he buys the a300 and barely used it. He scoured the forums and was told that canikon had a bigger following and Sony was nowhere on par with performance. So he returned it without giving it a fair chance.
    You on the other hand, how could you!?! lol... that's a really sad story. maybe your cousin will come around. It really make sense for family members to get one system. That way you can share lenses, accessories, and what not when you're together. It just makes life simpler that way. Oh well, your cousins loss not getting to share all your goodies!

    Quote Originally Posted by DonSchap View Post
    Elisha, I suggest you shoot his socks off and make him rethink his choice.

    Everytime I demonstrate what I can do with a SONY ... a 50mm f/1.4 prime ... SSS ... and at 1/15 second ... versus the same prime lens on a Nikon or Canon ... it makes for a very short argument. No matter how steady a person thinks they are ... 1/15 of a second usually brings out the worst in them. The resulting images are almost always an eye-opener.

    If there is any question, even if you only have your SONY Alpha with you:
    1. Put your 50mm on the camera
    2. Set the aperture to its widest setting
    3. Turn off the "SSS"
    4. Hand it to the non-believer and have them take their "steadiest" shot, handheld.
    5. Turn "SSS" back to the "on" position.
    6. Hand it to the non-believer, tell them to "just relax" and have them take the same shot, handheld.
    7. With the shot magnifier button, examine both shots on the camera's LCD, flipping back and forth.


    The proof should be there. That "SSS" shot should look quite sharp and clear. Now, do the same thing with a PRIME on a Nikon or Canon. Oh yeah ... no "SSS" ... sorry.

    Just throwing up the camera and doing just that ... (100% crop)

    SSS off (1/15 sec)
    Attachment 43429

    SSS on (1/15 sec)
    Attachment 43430

    Image shake tends to look like bad focus, but it is not, because everything is blurry, unlike bad focus, where there is some point in the image that usually is in focus, just not your "desired subject."
    I can actually do 1/8 or I've even done 1/6 sec hand held with SSS with the 50mm/1.7. It's harder for me to do with the 17-50mm, but 1/10 is entirely doable. Seems with a lighter lens and me gripping the RC2 plate with my left hand under neath, I can get a pretty damn steady shot. Let me see if I can get an example.
    flickr

    Canon 7D - 5D | 550EX - 430EX II - (2) PW FlexTT5 | 24-105 f4L | 70-200 f2.8L IS | 100 f2.8L IS | 50 f1.8 II

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Guelph, Ontario
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    he's already gotten the XSi so it's hard for me to tell him he made a bad choice.
    if i hadn't gotten the a300, i would have gotten the D80 myself.

    i've actually done a 1/3 and many other slow shutter shots with my prime at ISO 1600 in a glow in the dark mini put place
    Canon EOS 7D

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  6. #26
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Des Plaines, IL
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    Red face Steady as she goes ...

    Quote Originally Posted by dr4gon View Post
    I can actually do 1/8 or I've even done 1/6 sec hand held with SSS with the 50mm/1.7. It's harder for me to do with the 17-50mm, but 1/10 is entirely doable. Seems with a lighter lens and me gripping the RC2 plate with my left hand under neath, I can get a pretty damn steady shot. Let me see if I can get an example.
    @ Dr4gon: I was not trying to set a record, but merely demonstrate the ease with which you can shoot the SONY with SSS and get something that looks ... well, sharp.

    Most people shake like a leaf in the breeze when you hand them your camera. They have no concept of proper breathing when taking an image or other handling techniques -> Just up to the face and bang! The SONY caters to that kind of crappy handhold and delivers the goods, despite the lens. Of course, longer lenses are far more sensitive or less forgiving (apparently) to movement. We all can argue that, too ... but why? Just dump the non-SSS body and go with a "clear" choice.
    Don Schap - BFA, Digital Photography
    A Photographer Is Forever
    Look, I did not create the optical laws of the Universe ... I simply learned to deal with them.
    Remember: It is usually the GLASS, not the camera (except for moving to Full Frame), that gives you the most improvement in your photography.

    flickr & Sdi

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    2,204
    Provided are 1:1 crops of the following:


    (1/15 sec, see below)



    Just for fun, Here goes: (caption under image)


    1/4 sec, elbows leaning on table, not really trying here SSS on


    1/8 sec standing, SSS on, I'm bad at standing


    1/6 sitting upright, SSS on

    1/10 sitting upright, SSS off


    1/10, sitting upright SSS on, not much a difference


    1/8 sitting upright, SSS on



    1/15, sitting upright, sss on

    SSS does help get more clear shots! These are my best, some didin't turn out too hot under 1/10 lol...

    Looking more at these on the forum, they look slightly better on the computer in lightroom (RAW). Also zooming out (not 1:1) looks significantly better and you cannot tell there was any shake or blur at all.
    flickr

    Canon 7D - 5D | 550EX - 430EX II - (2) PW FlexTT5 | 24-105 f4L | 70-200 f2.8L IS | 100 f2.8L IS | 50 f1.8 II

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Ohio, USA.
    Posts
    1,161
    Scrolls through the above shots and wonders dr4gon how BIG are your hands! what do you do for a living? does it involve having huge grip strength? are you focused on your inner chi, how much Yoga does it take to center yourself LOL. Do you also 'shoot' dr4gon? anyway nice work.
    makes note to lay off the coffee.
    Sony A700_____________Minolta AF 50mm. F/1.7
    Minolta AF 70-210mm F/3.5-4.5 Tamron AF 17-50mm F/2.8 XR DiII LD Asp. [IF]
    Tamron SP AF 70-200mm. F/2.8 DI LD [IF] Macro
    Tamron AF 70-300mm F/4-5.6 Di LD Macro 1:2
    Tokina AF 28-70mm F/3.5-4.5
    Tokina AF AT-X 80-400mm F/4.5-5.6
    http://flickr.com/

  9. #29
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    Jun 2008
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    Quote Originally Posted by seanhoxx View Post
    Scrolls through the above shots and wonders dr4gon how BIG are your hands! what do you do for a living? does it involve having huge grip strength? are you focused on your inner chi, how much Yoga does it take to center yourself LOL. Do you also 'shoot' dr4gon? anyway nice work.
    makes note to lay off the coffee.
    I just try to keep the little square on a single target and just focus on keeping it there during the duration of the shot. It does help to practice a little bit. I remember Don came up with an exercise to improve on shooting at low shutter speeds, that seemed to help a bit, but I really just try to keep steady and shoot. Like I said, they don't always come out this good. Usually when I'm excited about what I'm shooting it's much harder for me to be calm and focus lol. My feet get all wobbly and I start to sway.

    Try sitting down and doing a few at 1/13, SSS on @ 50mm and go from there (slowly increase shutter speed to 1/8).
    flickr

    Canon 7D - 5D | 550EX - 430EX II - (2) PW FlexTT5 | 24-105 f4L | 70-200 f2.8L IS | 100 f2.8L IS | 50 f1.8 II

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    New Zealand
    Posts
    37
    Quote Originally Posted by dr4gon View Post
    Have you read vol 1 and 2 of Scott Kelby's digital photography books?
    Nah I haven't read that one, but I'll have a look this weekend. Cheers dr4gon
    -------------
    Sony Alpha 200
    Minolta AF 50mm f1.7
    Tokina AF 28-70mm f2.6-2.8
    Sony DT 18-70mm f3.5-5.6
    Minolta AF 70-210mm f4

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