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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Des Plaines, IL
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    Red face If frogs had wings ...

    Well, the day has finally come ... and one I never really thought would.

    I'm actually buying a SIGMA brand lens that I want. LOL

    Yeah, add it to the gearhead's list: SIGMA 10-20mm f/4-5.6 EX DC (SONY mount)

    Name:  Sigma_10-20mm-001.jpg
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    Now, I thought I would have no problem with waiting on buying this lens ... as the local store had three of these SONY-compatibles, last week, at Calumet Photography, in Oak Brook. Today ... Zero! What the heck?

    I made mention of how this was the preferred lens in Great Britain and wham ... sold out. Next time ... I'm waiting until I have mine, first, before I say anything like that again. Even the guy on the phone was going on about how much he liked this particular lens. Admittedly, the construction seemed a bit more thought out, for this lens. Less light bending in the first few elements. That's gotta result in less distortion and sharper imaging.

    SIGMA 10-20mm
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    TAMRON 11-18mm
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    So, okay ... my SIGMA-cherry is gone! Both the SONY 11-18mm and the TAMRON 11-18mm are inferior in comparison (they're the same lens - shhh, don't tell anyone), plus they're both more expensive, too. Guess you are paying for that "extra" element. (A nod to "Coldrain") The apparent quality of output is not especially reflected in the price.

    Yes, I'm giving up the TAMRON 6-year warranty for a better shot. Oh, the trade-offs I make. I'm so ashamed ...
    Last edited by DonSchap; 01-18-2008 at 03:42 PM.
    Don Schap - BFA, Digital Photography
    A Photographer Is Forever
    Look, I did not create the optical laws of the Universe ... I simply learned to deal with them.
    Remember: It is usually the GLASS, not the camera (except for moving to Full Frame), that gives you the most improvement in your photography.

    flickr & Sdi

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
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    1,760
    pretty dark lens

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Des Plaines, IL
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    This is a pretty "standard" base aperture for most wide-angle zooms.

    The TAMRON 11-18mm is f/4.5-5.6
    The Canon 10-22mm is f/3.5-4.5
    The SIGMA 12-24mm is f/4
    The Tokina 12-24mm is f/4
    The Nikon 12-24mm is f/4 ...
    there is a bright side ...
    The Nikon 14-24 f/2.8 <- a rare find.

    Anyway ... here's to the dark side ... which is a good segway to ...

    my intent, which is to start taking "architectural shots" of local homes for the upcoming realty/government farce when everyone gets tossed to the curb for not paying on their enormous mortgages. It's weird, no matter how many times I think about this, I realize that the government really allowed this happen to just raise property taxes with all these super-high mortgages. Then ... the bottom fell out.

    Anyway ... all these houses are for up sale and they need to be photographed. Like they say, a time and place for everything ... even opportunistic photography. Beats being a paparazzi I suppose. The subjects don't run off, get drunk or drive over people.
    Don Schap - BFA, Digital Photography
    A Photographer Is Forever
    Look, I did not create the optical laws of the Universe ... I simply learned to deal with them.
    Remember: It is usually the GLASS, not the camera (except for moving to Full Frame), that gives you the most improvement in your photography.

    flickr & Sdi

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
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    Des Plaines, IL
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    Okay ... the SIGMA AF 10-20mm f/4-5.6 EX DC came, today. I unboxed that bad boy and fired up the ol' α700, to give it a shot.

    Okay, at 10mm ... f/4 isn't going to be an option for sharp focus, close up. It's rather fuzzy. Even with flash ... nothing sharp, Repeated focus ... no improvement. It looks as though going to f/8 may have to do for the bulk of the heavylifting. I sort of expected this level of performance, but I had hoped. 10mm does offer one hell of a view, though, as you might expect. Almost wall to wall, so to speak.

    The weather, here, is getting way too slippery to chance running around with it, in the near future. I'll do some other focusing tests, later tonight .... but as lenses go, this remains to be seen ... (don't they all?)
    Don Schap - BFA, Digital Photography
    A Photographer Is Forever
    Look, I did not create the optical laws of the Universe ... I simply learned to deal with them.
    Remember: It is usually the GLASS, not the camera (except for moving to Full Frame), that gives you the most improvement in your photography.

    flickr & Sdi

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    God's Country - Australia
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    10,424
    hmm, i gotta disagree with you here Don. even wide open at 10mm the sigma is still pretty sharp in the center. the borders sharpness and distortions are where the issues lie.
    D800e l V3 l AW1 l 16-35 l 35 l 50 l 85 l 105 l EM1 l 7.5 l 12-40 l 14 l 17 l 25 l 45 l 60 l 75
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  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Des Plaines, IL
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    Red face Some lurid test results ...

    Well ... I did some comparisons, using a tripod, against the TAMRON SP AF 17-50mm f/2.8
    and I wasn't thrilled by the SIGMA 10-20mm f/4-5.6 in the comparison.

    I set both lenses to 17mm (lens barrel indicated) @ f/5.6, which is the best the SIGMA can do at this focal length. I simply swapped the lenses ... and multifocused for the best shot.

    I place the 100% crops side-by-side to compare them.

    Here are the results:

    SIGMA 10-20mm @ 17mm f/5.6 original image
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    SIGMA 10-20 100% crop
    Name:  10-20-17-f56-100.jpg
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    SIGMA ^

    TAMRON V
    Name:  17-50-17-f56-100.jpg
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    TAMRON 17-50 100% crop

    Name:  17-50 17 f56 full.jpg
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    TAMRON 17-50mm @ 17mm f/5.6 original image


    Then I set the new SIGMA lens for 10mm ... at the same f/5.6 exposure ... just to be fair.
    Name:  10-20 f56 10 100.jpg
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    Then upped it f/8
    Name:  10-20 f8 10 100.jpg
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    Then finally f/11
    Name:  10-20 f11 10 100.jpg
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    I'm sorry, but 10mm is significantly softer at f/5.6. I'm shooting at the minimum focal length ... which is neither here nor there ... but demonstrates the truly nice close-up cabilities of these two lenses. Unfortunately, you have to crank down on the aperture, at 10mm, to sharpen your focus to a reasonable level with the SIGMA.

    Is it me, or does the TAMRON seem a little better at color, also?

    I'll look at distortion, later.
    Last edited by DonSchap; 01-22-2008 at 09:25 PM.
    Don Schap - BFA, Digital Photography
    A Photographer Is Forever
    Look, I did not create the optical laws of the Universe ... I simply learned to deal with them.
    Remember: It is usually the GLASS, not the camera (except for moving to Full Frame), that gives you the most improvement in your photography.

    flickr & Sdi

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Des Plaines, IL
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    TAMRON has announced their intention to build and release a 10-24mm UWA.

    Here's the news!

    TAMRON DEVELOPS SP AF10-24MM F/3.5-4.5 DI II LD ASPHERICAL (IF) (MODEL AB001)



    A New High Performance Zoom Lens Designed for Exclusive Use on Digital SLR Cameras Covering the Ultra Wide-Angle Range



    PMA, January 31, 2008, Las Vegas, NV— Mr. Morio Ono, President of Tamron Co., Ltd., announced the development of the SP AF10-24mm F/3.5-4.5 Di II LD Aspherical (IF) (Model AB001), a new high performance ultra wide-angle zoom lens designed exclusively for digital SLR cameras with APS-C size imagers.
    * “Di (Digitally-Integrated design)-II” lenses are designed for exclusive use on digital cameras with smaller-size imagers.
    * This lens is not designed for use with 35mm film cameras and digital SLR cameras with image sensors larger than 24mm x 16mm.

    The new SP AF10-24mm F/3.5-4.5 Di II LD Aspherical (IF) is an advanced ultra wide-angle zoom lens that is versatile and offers even higher performance and specifications than the current Tamron SP AF11-18mm F/4.5-5.6 zoom lens.

    The lens covers an extended focal length range that is particularly wide for an ultra wide-angle zoom lens, while improving the aperture to F/3.5-4.5 and keeping the filter diameter to 77mm. Its lightweight and compact size makes this new wide-angle zoom very user friendly.

    The lens was designed for use with digital SLR cameras and thereby employs special optical glass materials for outstanding optical performance such as large-aperture glass-molded aspherical elements and hybrid aspherical elements.


    Main Features

    Compact Ultra Wide-angle Zoom Lens Covering a Broad Range from 10mm to 24mm
    The new Tamron zoom covers a focal length range equivalent to 16-37mm* when converted to a 35mm full-size format. Its ultra-wide zoom ratio of more than 2X provides a versatile variety of angles of view, thus improving photographic creativity.
    *Tamron’s conversion ratio is 1.5x.

    Features an Optical Design Optimized for Digital Camera Characteristics Ensures High Optical Performance
    (1) Employment of Special Optical Glass Materials Provides High Performance The new zoom lens uses an HID glass element and a pair of LD glass elements to minimize on-axis and lateral chromatic aberrations that are the greatest hindrance to high optical quality. To further achieve outstanding optical quality, the lens uses a high quality, glass-molded aspherical element and three hybrid aspherical elements to thoroughly compensate for spherical and comatic aberrations and distortion.
    * HID – High Index/High Dispersion optical glass
    * LD – Low Dispersion optical glass

    (2) Optical Design Optimizes the Angles of Incidences of Light Rays Reaching the Imager The ultra wide zoom lens uses a new optical system designed to confine the changing angles of incidences of light rays reaching the imager within a certain scope over the entire image field from the center to the periphery, by considering the effects of variances due to zooming.

    (3) Enhanced Peripheral Illumination Peripheral light fall-off is minimized so that images are high quality from the center to the periphery.

    (4) Outstanding Resolution As an SP Di II class lens, it provides high optical quality in terms of resolution, contrast and flatness of image field.

    (5) Internal Surface Coating Reduces Ghosting and Flare The lens uses a newly developed multiple coating and internal surface coating, (i.e., multiple-layer coatings on cemented surfaces of plural lenses) to reduce the image degradation caused by the reflection of light rays entering from the lens front and affected by the imager.

    Ultra Compact and Lightweight Design
    The new zoom lens covers a wider focal length range with a greater zoom ratio and offers a faster maximum aperture and enhanced optical quality than the existing SP AF11-18mm zoom lens. Despite higher specifications that are likely to incur a bulky design, the new zoom lens is lightweight and compact. Tamron has successfully realized a versatile ultra wide-angle zoom lens that is lightweight and compact enough in overall length and diameter to accept a 77mm filter, the same as the existing SP AF11-18mm zoom lens.

    Minimum Focus Distance of 0.24m throughout the Entire Zoom Range
    Considering the importance of “close focusing capability” as an essential condition in wide-angle photography, Tamron has achieved a 0.24m minimum focus distance over the entire zoom range. Getting closer to the subject allows you to easily express a more creative photographic vision.

    Flower-shaped Lens Hood
    A glare-reducing flower-shaped lens hood is included as a standard accessory. The special hood provides optimum shading of superfluous light rays that enter from the rectangular frame outside the image field.

    New External Design Conveying “High Performance, High Precision Image” on the Basis of Tamron’s Conventional Lens Design
    The external design is improved to enhance the uniformity and smoothness. The metallic finish of the gold band of Tamron lenses makes it stand out as a Di II lens, while the layout of alphanumerical markings is improved for better visibility. The rubber patterns of the zoom and focus rings have also been improved to compliment today’s digital camera design style and to provide better handling.



    Specifications
    Tamron SP AF10-24mm F/3.5-4.5 Di-II LD Aspherical [IF]
    Model Name AB001
    Focal Length 10-24mm
    Maximum Aperture F/3.5-4.5
    Minimum Aperture F/22
    Angle Of View 108 44' - 60 20' (APS-C size equivalent)
    Lens Construction 12 elements / 9 groups
    MFD (Minimum Focus Distance) 0.24m (entire zoom range)
    Diaphragm Blades 7
    Filter Size 77mm
    Size (Diameter x Length) 3.3 in. x 3.4 in. (83.2mm x 86.5mm)*
    Weight 370g (13.1 oz)*
    Max. Mag. Ratio 1:5.1 (at f=24mm)
    Standard Accessory Flower-Shaped hood
    Compatible Mount Canon, Nikon, Pentax, Sony
    *specifications based on Nikon mount
    Don Schap - BFA, Digital Photography
    A Photographer Is Forever
    Look, I did not create the optical laws of the Universe ... I simply learned to deal with them.
    Remember: It is usually the GLASS, not the camera (except for moving to Full Frame), that gives you the most improvement in your photography.

    flickr & Sdi

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    3
    Don,
    Whatever happened to your Sigma lens? I am looking to buy this exact same lens for my a350, but now I am not so sure that I want to purchase the Sigma instead of the Tamron or the Tokina.

    What did Sigma have to say about their quality control issue?

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Des Plaines, IL
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    I looked at the time and costs involved in returning the SIGMA for a "tweak" (the problem was not severe enough to give up the lens) ... and decided not to. I need the lens for my regular shooting, at events ... and most (85%) of the stuff I shoot is at distances where a snappy, sharp focus would go truly unappreciated. Indeed, I have other glass in my bag (17-50mm zoom, 90mm MACRO, 180mm MACRO) that I can use for the real sharp-looking, close-up work. Unfortunately, many others on the forum do not have that kind of fall back available to them.

    The best idea I can put forth, at this juncture, is to go ahead and buy the lens and just check it out, thoroughly ... because, it looks like SIGMA certainly DID NOT do the rock solid QA we would love to see and expect in our optics. These puppies are still on the shelves, just like mine was. They need a good looking at, by an interested party (YOU) to determine if they are indeed sharp ... and if not, SEND IT BACK BEFORE YOU REALLY NEED IT.

    I still have until January 2009 to get mine returned to SIGMA. If I do happen to pick up a TAMRON SP AF 10-24mm f/3.5-4.5 Di LD ... you can bet that I will then take the time (normally 2-months there and back again), because my bases will be covered, at that point.

    The 10-20mm seems to be a nice lens ... but, I am still, personally, looking forward to the new TAMRON. Others may disagree ... and that's fine, but ... their glass works pretty well for what I do with it.

    Good luck in your decision. We've all been there.
    Don Schap - BFA, Digital Photography
    A Photographer Is Forever
    Look, I did not create the optical laws of the Universe ... I simply learned to deal with them.
    Remember: It is usually the GLASS, not the camera (except for moving to Full Frame), that gives you the most improvement in your photography.

    flickr & Sdi

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Des Plaines, IL
    Posts
    9,560
    Since UWA questions have reared their heads (Sean ... ), I thought I would roll out this thread, that discussed it. It's worth a look, in light of the new TAMRON 10-24
    Don Schap - BFA, Digital Photography
    A Photographer Is Forever
    Look, I did not create the optical laws of the Universe ... I simply learned to deal with them.
    Remember: It is usually the GLASS, not the camera (except for moving to Full Frame), that gives you the most improvement in your photography.

    flickr & Sdi

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