My dilema: Powershot G6 or S2 IS ?

[ibarbar]

Hello, this beeing my first post here, congrats to mr Jeff for being the first to review the S2 IS today :D great job and also keep up the good work that you are doing with your site.

I have a HUGE problem: I want to upgrade from my excellent Powershot A80 which has more than deserved its money, to a higher MP camera, still Canon (since I'm a Canon fan, my first camera was the EOS 33 :)). Considering my budget, I have to decide between the G6 and the new S2 IS. My problem is that the G6 has the 7MP sensor, the MD filter, and so on, but it's more expensive than the S2, which has the zoom lens, movie mode and AA batteries, but only 5MP. If I am to buy the G6 I definetly need to buy the conversion lens and the telephoto converter (maybe the macro one too) which will add considerably to the price of the camera.

I would like to hear other opinions on this subject and maybe someone can make a shoot-out between the G6 and the S2.

Thanks.
Iancu (aka ibarbar).

[Montana]

I would get the S2. The G6 is trying to be a DSLR without actually being one. Then save up for a DSLR later and the S2 would make a great compliment to it.

[ibarbar]

Thanx for taking the time to answer.

One argument for the S2 would be that even if it has only 5MP it has the 12x lens which will get you closer than the G6. I was also looking at the Pro1 camera, wonder why it's still so expensive compared to the G6 and the S2, since it had quite some flaws (pics quality and other).

One argument for the G6 would be the bigger sensor (meaning better quality ?) as the G6 has a 1/1.8 " (7.18 x 5.32 mm) sensor while the S2 has only a 1/2.5 " sensor. And something I'd like to have: the infrared remote :D

And another thing, why is the Pro1 considered an advanced camera while the G6 is just normal point and shoot ? What does the Pro1 have beside the better lens and slightly bigger sensor ?

Still waiting for other opinions.

[JTL]

The G6 is not considered a "normal" point-and-shoot. It is a dSLR alternative. I have 3 Canons, G6, SD500 and S2. If the S2 were 7MP, I might get rid of the G6...because for some of my more elaborate photo projects, I need the resolution. So it comes down to this for me:

G6: My "pro" camera when I'm doing portraits, difficult or demanding image capture situations or need the built-in ND filter or the fast lens and super-high resolution and remote control capability and high-powered external flash...

SD500: My "snapshot" camera for doing spontaneous street scene, party and other type of photography where holding a larger camera might interfere with the shooting. Great advantage is I don't sacrifice image quality one little bit. I use it as a serious working tool.

S2: Right now I'm still testing it, but this is my "fun" camera...the camera for me and not my work. It will definitely be my vacation camera. I love it to death so far, but it just doesn't have enough resolution to use for my work. All-and-all, it's the one I'd probably recommend to friends and family who weren't looking for an ultracompact...it's got every feature almost anyone could want yet is easy to use and the photos look great...

[vancouverislander]

Just want to mention your posts are consistently informative. No bs. Made me smile when I read you 'love it to death so far'. When talking to people about my new S2 I find myself almost 'gushing' - it's far more camera than I expected. Feel I've been lucky so far, had the Coolpix 995 and still love it.

According to Jeff's review people now have a choice of 4 great ultrazoom cameras - that's amazing. My decision was easy - can't give up the rotating lcd.

[van_city]

Just want to mention your posts are consistently informative. No bs. Made me smile when I read you 'love it to death so far'. When talking to people about my new S2 I find myself almost 'gushing' - it's far more camera than I expected. Feel I've been lucky so far, had the Coolpix 995 and still love it.

According to Jeff's review people now have a choice of 4 great ultrazoom cameras - that's amazing. My decision was easy - can't give up the rotating lcd.

Just out of curiosity, why the need for a rotating LCD? I never understood this feature...

[vancouverislander]

You can take pictures at angles your body couldn't stretch or crouch at - I enjoy taking pictures of the flowers in my garden, reach over and snap a pic from the side, top, bottom - whatever angle and whatever background looks best - put it down below a flower and have a beautiful blue sky as background - hold it above your head, tuck it in spots where your body wouldn't fit or you'd damage other plants. Great way to get candid pics. People don't realize you're taking pictures and don't react the same when you use a camera without the rotating lcd - especially children. Endless possibilities - they should call it a contortion feature. Don't know if I've explained it very well - anyone else like to add?

Just out of curiosity, why the need for a rotating LCD? I never understood this feature...

[JTL]

You can take pictures at angles your body couldn't stretch or crouch at - I enjoy taking pictures of the flowers in my garden, reach over and snap a pic from the side, top, bottom - whatever angle and whatever background looks best - put it down below a flower and have a beautiful blue sky as background - hold it above your head, tuck it in spots where your body wouldn't fit or you'd damage other plants. Great way to get candid pics. People don't realize you're taking pictures and don't react the same when you use a camera without the rotating lcd - especially children. Endless possibilities - they should call it a contortion feature. Don't know if I've explained it very well - anyone else like to add?Good points all...it's one of those things that if you shoot a lot, you'll wonder how you ever got along without it. Plus I'll add one that people always leave out...when your camera is in your equipment bag, you can turn around the LCD so it doesn't get banged up or scratched...

[vancouverislander]

Good points all...it's one of those things that if you shoot a lot, you'll wonder how you ever got along without it. Plus I'll add one that people always leave out...when your camera is in your equipment bag, you can turn around the LCD so it doesn't get banged up or scratched...

See how spoiled I am already - totally forgot. What a bonus. Still can't pick up the 995 without getting at least one finger on the lcd.

[ibarbar]

Yes very good explanations. One of the things I'd like to see on a DSLR would be a "Powershot" LCD, though that would be highly unlikely to happen. It's just too good to not take into consideration. Very good point, vancouverislander, about taking photos of people, they tend to be relaxed, not knowing you're taking photos, people are a lot more different when you photograph them using a rotating LCD than when you're pointing aggressivly a large SLR lens at them, they get the feeling that you're really going to 'shoot' them :). Plus the places you can't get, fit or reach to.

Nice talk but it's getting a little off topic and I'd like to hear some more opinions about comparing the G6 and the S2, and maybe Pro1.

Need to make up my mind :D

[JTL]

Nice talk but it's getting a little off topic and I'd like to hear some more opinions about comparing the G6 and the S2, and maybe Pro1.

Need to make up my mind :DThey're simply not comparable in the way that you are trying to compare them. The G6 and S2 are two completely different cameras for completely different purposes that have specs that are so different as to make a rational comparison between them illogical. Define your needs, then look at your options...

[vancouverislander]

Went back and read the thread - sorry - got carried away. :o

[Montana]

Those are good points.

When I was in Glacier National Park last summer my friend had a Canon a95 with the swivel LCD. We both wanted to get ground level shots of the river(Flathead). I had to get on my stomach, get my shirt wet, scuff up my knees , and all from the shore.

He stood knee deep in the water, held his camera low, flipped the LCD and took the shot.

While I think the Fuji 3800 I was using took better quality pics, he got the better shot on that one.


EDIT: that was an A80 he was using.

[Montana]

I should also add that I was at Best Buy today looking for a deal on memory (haha yeah right). I played with the H1 and the S2. I have to say that 2.5 inch LCD on the back of the H1 is GREAT. I also noticed the Sony focused alot faster as well.

So big screens IMHO have their merits as well.

[ibarbar]

I never was a fan of Sony, mainly because they make great amateur cameras, which don't have many manual options and settings (the single fact that they don't have DSLR's says a lot) like the Nikon and Canon do. And I'm no sucker for big LCDs. Yes, they're nice, impressive (especially the 2,5" ones), but I prefer other things to big LCDs.

Yes JTL, you have a point there, the G6 and the S2 are quite different targeted, but unfortunately, so are my needs. that's why I can't decide that easily. I'm a graphic designer, so I use many of my photos in prints so more MP would mean better and larger prints, but I also do a lot of photography for my own pleasure and many times I find myself wanting a larger zoom lens and a closer macro. So my needs are oriented towards a more "pro" camera (a 20D would be great :D but that's a LOT of money, or even the Rebel XT, but both would require a decent lens).

Finally it will be a price decision, I think, adding all the things that I have to buy beside the camera, and seeing which one will cost me less considering all the accessories.

Maybe others will have other opinions on the cameras here in question :).

[JTL]

I never was a fan of Sony, mainly because they make great amateur cameras, which don't have many manual options and settings (the single fact that they don't have DSLR's says a lot) like the Nikon and Canon do. And I'm no sucker for big LCDs. Yes, they're nice, impressive (especially the 2,5" ones), but I prefer other things to big LCDs.

Yes JTL, you have a point there, the G6 and the S2 are quite different targeted, but unfortunately, so are my needs. that's why I can't decide that easily. I'm a graphic designer, so I use many of my photos in prints so more MP would mean better and larger prints, but I also do a lot of photography for my own pleasure and many times I find myself wanting a larger zoom lens and a closer macro. So my needs are oriented towards a more "pro" camera (a 20D would be great :D but that's a LOT of money, or even the Rebel XT, but both would require a decent lens).

Finally it will be a price decision, I think, adding all the things that I have to buy beside the camera, and seeing which one will cost me less considering all the accessories.

Many others will have other opinions on the cameras here in question :).Ah ha...now maybe I can actually be of some assistance! :)

A solution for you might be to get the G6 and pick up the excellent TC-DC58N 1.75 tele-extender for it. This gives an effective telephoto range of 245mm! Not too shabby. You can have your megapixels and your zoom too (maybe that should replace "you can have your cake and eat it" as the standard saying! :D)

As far as macro goes, the S2 allows you to focus at 0mm, and the G6 at 5mm...can't ask for better than that...although the G6's faster lens (f/2.0) allows for much more dramatic marco shooting...

If your thinking dSLR, I think you will be more satisfied with the G6, although the S2 is a whole lotta fun. Hope this helps a little...

[ibarbar]

Just read it now on some other topics, it seems the G6 is getting replaced soon since it's not in some stores anymore. Anyone know anything ?

[ibarbar]

Ah ha...now maybe I can actually be of some assistance! :)

A solution for you might be to get the G6 and pick up the excellent TC-DC58N 1.75 tele-extender for it. This gives an effective telephoto range of 245mm! Not too shabby. You can have your megapixels and your zoom too (maybe that should replace "you can have your cake and eat it" as the standard saying! :D)

As far as macro goes, the S2 allows you to focus at 0mm, and the G6 at 5mm...can't ask for better than that...although the G6's faster lens (f/2.0) allows for much more dramatic marco shooting...

If your thinking dSLR, I think you will be more satisfied with the G6, although the S2 is a whole lotta fun. Hope this helps a little...

10x a lot for the help, yes that was my intention too at first, maybe will go for this one, but then again, I will also have to buy a spare battery for the G6. Plus the converter, plus the telephoto... that adds some money to the price. Don't know yet, anyway I'm planning to buy the camera in 2 months so maybe Canon will release the G6 replacement and I'll buy that :D

We'll see.
Thanks again.

[JTL]

10x a lot for the help, yes that was my intention too at first, maybe will go for this one, but then again, I will also have to buy a spare battery for the G6. Plus the converter, plus the telephoto... that adds some money to the price. Don't know yet, anyway I'm planning to buy the camera in 2 months so maybe Canon will release the G6 replacement and I'll buy that :D

We'll see.
Thanks again.All bets are on a August/September announcement for the G7...but remember...it will be a month or two after the announcement before it's available. If you can wait, that's great. The other viable option for you is to go with the Canon 350D (XT) with the Sigma 18-200 or Sigma 70-300 APO. If that's where you're ultimately heading, it might be time to take a hard look...

The truth is, and I hate to say it, that the G6 for all it's greatness is a bit "old" and I understand wanting to wait. I guess right now, if I were in your shoes and if I could wait I would...it will have the Digic II processor for sure and that alone will be worth the wait...

[ibarbar]

Are you saying that the G6 doesn't have the Digic II ? The S2 does, right ?

How big is the difference ?

Here's the deal on how much I can wait: somebody will come to the US for the summer and will return late october so that's my final date that I can make my option for the camera. Hope that the new model will appear till then on the market. Otherwise I have to get one of the existing models.

10x for the Sigma lenses tip, I will look it up.

[ibarbar]

Hmm, quite quiet around here, I was hoping for a few more opinions and advice. Too bad.

JTL, if you could answer my previous questions.. thanks anyway.
Is the DIGIC II on the S2 worth more than G6's processor ? Is the difference worth it ?

I'm waiting...


Just read it: the G6 has a DIGIC with iSAPS processor so I wonder again how different are the 2 processors, which gets the better image...and so on.

[JTL]

Hmm, quite quiet around here, I was hoping for a few more opinions and advice. Too bad.

JTL, if you could answer my previous questions.. thanks anyway.
Is the DIGIC II on the S2 worth more than G6's processor ? Is the difference worth it ?

I'm waiting...


Just read it: the G6 has a DIGIC with iSAPS processor so I wonder again how different are the 2 processors, which gets the better image...and so on.The Digic II is definitly the superior processor...much faster start up and performance, better image processing and allows for a better video mode (only I don't think that is on your list of requirements). Is it worth the wait? I don't know. I can't really answer that...I use all my cameras so differently...I have totally separated out function. But, if I could only keep one one my cameras...I pretty sure it would be the G6, and that's my only Canon that doesn't have the Digic II...but it's the one I use the least. But that's just me and I'm wacky...

I wish someone else would offer an opinion as well...

[ydna45]

As between the S2 and the G6, which would be likely to take better pictures without flash in the low light of say the first or second row of a rock concert, where I would have to rely on the lights on stage? Anyone with thoughts or experience on this, I would love to hear from you. Thanks much.

[JTL]

As between the S2 and the G6, which would be likely to take better pictures without flash in the low light of say the first or second row of a rock concert, where I would have to rely on the lights on stage? Anyone with thoughts or experience on this, I would love to hear from you. Thanks much.The faster lens and larger sensor favor the G6 but neither camera is a stellar low-light performer. You really need a dSLR for that sort of thing to get quality results.

Just shot some pictures at Yankee Stadium (which is pretty well lit...it was a night game) with the S2 but had to use ISO 400 and they are pretty noisy...they look good but noisy. Here's one:

Canon S2, ISO 400, f/4.0, 1/160 sec., focal length 646mm equiv. (with TC-DC58B tele converter)
http://jtl.smugmug.com/photos/25139938-L.jpg

[JTL]

Here's the same S2 shot as above run through Noise Ninja with fairly conservative settings. Not too bad...ISO 400 is useable much to my surprise and delight...

http://jtl.smugmug.com/photos/25143958-L.jpg

[vedanthi]

And you can take self portrait/closeup shots. No need to ask somebody else.

[Ebx]

Here's the same S2 shot as above run through Noise Ninja with fairly conservative settings. Not too bad...ISO 400 is useable much to my surprise and delight...

I think the image looks a lot better without the Noise Ninja-treatment - the ground looks like a waterpainting in the after-shot.

[IlBianconero]

I think the image is much better without Noise Ninja processing.
ibarbar , i like your pics very much...just lovely!
You know,I think I cannot advise you in any way,but you could give me some advice...i don't want to go offtopic here so I will stop...since we are both from Romania,can you give me a contact address?I would like to ask you some questions...thank you.

[anonymouse]

Considering my budget, I have to decide between the G6 and the new S2 IS. My problem is that the G6 has the 7MP sensor, the MD filter, and so on, but it's more expensive than the S2, which has the zoom lens, movie mode and AA batteries, but only 5MP.

I have been agonizing over this very same issue. I have a $350 S2 IS from DELL being shipped as we speak, but after seeing the S2 at Best Buy, I am not sure if I want such a bulky (subjective, just my opinion) unit (I would rather buy a DSLR and be done once and for all). I want a camera that I will be happy carrying around everywhere.

If I want to shoot movies I would rather use my camcorder without worrying about running out of memory.

I am also concerned about buying the very first few S2 IS batches (although I dont expect any problems with it being a Canon).

I have a couple of external hot shoe compatible flash units which I would like to use with the G6, plus I am much more comfortable with the size of G6. It is smaller than the S2 IS. I have existing CF cards which I can reuse. My goal is to not worry about shooting macros and/or long zoom shots, although I would be talking many spectator pictures of my kids on stage, etc.

I also hear people talk about Digic I/II, it is really not important for me, all I care is that the G6 takes crisp pictures.

Therefore, I prefer the picture quality of G6 (subjective of course).

Which brings up my issue, I have two existing (old) Panasonic flash units. Would they work with the G6 ? Or do I need to spend the money and buy a 380/420EX ?

Ultimately, all technical arguments aside, I think I want to be happy with my choice and my very first instinct has been to stick with the G6.

I would appreciate your thoughts if you have'nt chimed in :)

[ydna45]

JTL - - thanks for your thoughts and for posting the photos. Did you take any others at the Yankees' game? Any actions shots? I would be interested in seeing those if it is not too much trouble. From what you said in another thread, it sounds like it might be pretty difficult to get good actions shots, ie, the thirdbaseman fielding a bunt and tossing the ball to first base.

Also, how far down the third base line and how high up were you sitting when you took that shot? Thanks again.

[JTL]

JTL - - thanks for your thoughts and for posting the photos. Did you take any others at the Yankees' game? Any actions shots? I would be interested in seeing those if it is not too much trouble. From what you said in another thread, it sounds like it might be pretty difficult to get good actions shots, ie, the thirdbaseman fielding a bunt and tossing the ball to first base.

Also, how far down the third base line and how high up were you sitting when you took that shot? Thanks again.I was pretty much in line with third base just under the overhang (Section 16, Row C) I guess about 30-40 rows from the field. I didn't take that many pictures...there was just too much action (last Tuesday's blowout) and too much fan activity to get good unobstructed shots. All were taken using the TC-DC58B tele converter and at ISO 400. In addition, this was my first time using the camera with the tele converter, at night and during an activity...so I'm still getting use to shooting with it. Here's a link to more photos: http://jtl.smugmug.com/gallery/597522/1/25139938