Paralyzed dSLR buyer needs input

[AllanMarcus]

I can't decide between the Canon Rebel, Rebel XT, E-Volt, D70, or *ist DS. Clearly they are ll great cameras. The only accessory I have that would be usable by these cameras is an olympus FL-20 flash.

A little about me. I'v owned a Fuji s602 then an Olympus C750 (which I still use). I'd like to move up t a camera with better indoor pictures and much faster focusing. While I liked the Fuji, it was too big for me at he time, so I switched to the Olympus. I know a dSLR will be huge compared the Olympus but I'm willing to sacrifice that for the quality. I'll keep the Olympus for when I want a small light camera.

I plan t use the kit lens and get a 75-300 ish zoom (maybe a 75-200).

Seems to me all these dSLRs have pretty good lens options (I checked at BHPhoto.com), and all these cameras have great specs and prices. Every day I "lean" toward a different model, but I am drawn to the Rebel XT for is smallest weight. At this size, those, I'm not sure how a couple of ounces will feel.

Original Rebel: Great cameral at a great price (<$700 w/lens kit).
Rebel XT: Better camera, still a good price. Lightest of the bunch.
Both canon cameras can use a reasonably priced image stabilized lens, which I'm considering.

Olympus: Good reviews. Built in CCD cleaner. I have an olympus flash.

Nikon: What can I say, it's a Nikon! Great camera, but it's the heaviest.

Pentax: Looks to be a great camera, and is moderately light.

I think the prices of these cameras is about to go down even more, so I'm in no rush.

what are your thoughts?

-Allan

[timmciglobal]

Well quality wise nothing beats canon right now, ISO 100 images are just amazing, and the ISO 1600 samples from XT while not as good as 20D are very good.

I was dispointed with noise performance on D70 personally, and the Pentax camera seems like a D70 redone (same sensor)

I'd go with an XT personally.

Tim

[jeisner]

I would try them out in a store to see which one is most comfortable for you to use.... I chose the *ist DS over the 300d because TO ME the 300d just felt plastic and cheap. I much prefered the build quality of the Olympus or Pentax, the nice range of quality Pentax lenses and better high ISO performance of the Pentax meant I chose that.... The Pentax was also cheaper and felt better in my hands than the Olympus.

The Nikon was just way to big and expensive (here anyway) and the Pentax as mentioned uses the same Sony sensor as the Nikon D70 and has MLU which the D70 lacked, so as MLU and camera size/weight were important to me, that took the D70 out of the running for me....


But as I said that was my choice, decide which features you can live without and which you can't, this may narrow your choice? and then go into a store where you can actually use the cameras, actually feeling the cameras in your hands and snappinng off a few shots with each is an important test IMHO...

[speaklightly]

Allan-

Since size is certainly a consideration for you, that narrows it down probably to the Pentax 1stDS and the Canon DigRebel XT.

I felt the Pentax was a great dSLR, but it showed too much noise at 3200 and I do a lot of existing light work.

Sarah Joyce

[AllanMarcus]

After reading a lot more last night on many forums, I'm leaning towards the canon line. Basically, the common wisdom is that the canons are much faster (at startup, at focusing, and at shot to shot). Since one of my biggest desires is faster focusing, the canons are looking better.

Now to decide if the XT is work the extra $250. It seems to me a good first dSLR is the regular rebel. But then again, it's "only" $250 more? Arrrggg! too many decisions! :-)

Also, to decide if I should get the lens kit model, or get the "Zoom Wide Angle-Telephoto EF 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS Image Stabilizer USM Autofocus Lens" ($395 from B&H) as my main lens. People seem to be raving about this lens.

Rebel with kit: $670 at Dell
Rebel body only: $631 at Butterfly

If I get the 28-135 will I ever use the kit lens?

Also, for an extra $30 bucks I can get a Mack warranty. Is it worth it?

Any thoughts on using this 28-135 lens with a 2X teleconverter?

Thanks,

Allan

[gary_hendricks]

The Canon Digital Rebel XT is another stunning winner from Canon. It features faster speeds (start-up and shot-to-shot), excellent image quality, and terrific look-and-feel. Despite my personal preference for Nikon pro-level gear, I can recommend this Canon d-SLR to my friends without reservation.

[jeisner]

I have never understood the start-up time obsession.... I turn my DS on and lift it up to my eye, it is well and truly ready by then, why does it matter it in a lab test with a stop watch counting milliseconds there is a little difference????

I still recommend trying out the cameras you are looking at yourself, your the one who has to live with the purchase....

[timmciglobal]

The 28>135 is a nice lens but keep in mind its 44>216 once you factor in crop, that makes it pretty long. If you don't tend to shoot wide then it won't be an issue, but if you want the 3 foot away "group of people" shot it won't work.

The 18>125 Sigma is a choice too.

If you ask me, better ISO performance on XT and the E-TTL2 is worth it.

Tim

[D70FAN]

So I guess it's time for the Nikon D70 advocate to speak. The first thing to mention is that weight and size is not as important as balance and ergonomics. The Nikon D70, like Nikon professional equipment, is built to carry one-handed all day, and controls are laid out for quick setting and right where they belong, playing on what Nikon has gleaned from professionals over the years.

Image quality is a given with the D70. Since I've only seen test shots, it's hard to say if the new 8MP sensor in the XT is as good. I do plan to spend some time with the XT in the next couple of weeks. But what I can gleen from previews so far is this:

The Canon DReb XT was designed to "catch up" with the D70 in the same price range. Other than the 8MP imager it's not quite there yet, and it seems like corners were cut to accomplish the goal. Some quick setting functions have been moved to the main menu, which is inconvenient, and if ergonomics are similar to the DReb (and it appears they are) then that too is unfortunate.

There are still many key functions/parameters available on the D70 that are not on the XT. But if you've never had them, you probably won't miss them. Well, maybe the spot metering... or 1/500 sec flash sync, or 1/8000 sec shutter speed... and doesn't the XT flash pop up for the AF assist to function? That's annoying...

The difference between the XT and the D70 is that Nikon designed the D70 to be an entry level dSLR that emulates their professional dSLR's, and the XT, and the DReb before it, is Canon is throwing MegaPixels into a consumer level digicam and deftly disguised as a dSLR. I can set down the D70 and pick up a D1X or a D2H, and know exactly how it works and with the same control layout. Try that with the XT and the 1Ds, or even the 20D.

The XT is a vast improvement over the DReb, and I've said before that I would rather have any dSLR over any all-in-one, but the XT is not a D70 killer.

[jeisner]

Ohh another consideration when/if you do try out the camera before you buy it :) take notice of the different viewfinder sizes/magnification, this is especially important if you use manual focus for example for macro work... The bigger viewfinders make this easier, and canon has a nasty habit it seems of providing tiny viewfinders on their entry level models!!!

[D70FAN]

Ohh another consideration when/if you do try out the camera before you buy it :) take notice of the different viewfinder sizes/magnification, this is especially important if you use manual focus for example for macro work... The bigger viewfinders make this easier, and canon has a nasty habit it seems of providing tiny viewfinders on their entry level models!!!

Thanks for bringing that up as in addition the D70 also has an overlay grid on the viewfinder to help you keep the picture level/square.

[jeisner]

LOL, I actually brought it up in the *ist DS's favour, definately not in the D70s favour ;-)

Ist DS = 0.95x (pentaprism)
20d = 0.95x (pentaprism)
XT = 0.8x (pentamirror)
D70 = 0.75x (pentamirror)

Anyway I do like the D70 overlay grid, for the ist DS it is an additional $44 to get the focusing grid with the grid on it, not a big deal really, but a nice addition in the D70....

[D70FAN]

LOL, I actually brought it up in the *ist DS's favour, definately not in the D70s favour ;-)

Ist DS = 0.95x (pentaprism)
20d = 0.95% (pentaprism)
XT = 0.8x (pentamirror)
D70 = 0.75x (pentamirror)

Anyway I do like the D70 overlay grid, for the ist DS it is an additional $44 to get the focusing grid with the grid on it, not a big deal really, but a nice addition in the D70....

Doh! It's more or less a don't care on my side, but it may indeed be important for someone out there. I do use manual focus, and have to admit that the pentaprism would be a nice addition. Again not critical.

[Norm in Fujino]

Ohh another consideration when/if you do try out the camera before you buy it :) take notice of the different viewfinder sizes/magnification, this is especially important if you use manual focus for example for macro work... The bigger viewfinders make this easier, and canon has a nasty habit it seems of providing tiny viewfinders on their entry level models!!!

That's an important consideration. Back when I was surveying ultrazooms I noticed that several cameras in the same general form-factor range had tiny electronic viewfinders compared even to the one on the camera I eventually bought (Oly c-755). I hate electronic viewfinders, so that was one factor in my decision.
I've also been pondering the new xt (based on reviews) for a while, but haven't actually held one in the store yet (today is the official first day for marketing it here in Japan). But on a cautionary note, one might read the XT review on Luminous Landscape (http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/xt-350d.shtml), since while generally quite positive, it provides some unvarnished criticisms of Canon's decision to go with a tiny "tunnel-vision" viewfinder and the notoriously dark menu screens (one wonders whether will it be possible to change those in a firmware revision).

All the cameras you mention will take great photos. Startup time is probably less a factor than you think, and they probably all have adequate focusing and shutter lag times as well, considering the actual use the cameras will likely see (individual needs differ, obviously . . .). It really pays to hold one in your hands and check the ergonomics, build quality, and how the controls match your own style of shooting. And while the Canons have excellent high-ISO performance, consider your actual usage; if you don't anticipate doing lots of shooting at ISO 1600, you can remove a lot of noise on your occasional high-ISO shots with Neat Image or Noise Ninja.
Decisions, decisions . . . :confused:

[D70FAN]

That's an important consideration. Back when I was surveying ultrazooms I noticed that several cameras in the same general form-factor range had tiny electronic viewfinders compared even to the one on the camera I eventually bought (Oly c-755). I hate electronic viewfinders, so that was one factor in my decision.
I've also been pondering the new xt (based on reviews) for a while, but haven't actually held one in the store yet (today is the official first day for marketing it here in Japan). But on a cautionary note, one might read the XT review on Luminous Landscape (http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/xt-350d.shtml), since while generally quite positive, it provides some unvarnished criticisms of Canon's decision to go with a tiny "tunnel-vision" viewfinder and the notoriously dark menu screens (one wonders whether will it be possible to change those in a firmware revision).

All the cameras you mention will take great photos. Startup time is probably less a factor than you think, and they probably all have adequate focusing and shutter lag times as well, considering the actual use the cameras will likely see (individual needs differ, obviously . . .). It really pays to hold one in your hands and check the ergonomics, build quality, and how the controls match your own style of shooting. And while the Canons have excellent high-ISO performance, consider your actual usage; if you don't anticipate doing lots of shooting at ISO 1600, you can remove a lot of noise on your occasional high-ISO shots with Neat Image or Noise Ninja.
Decisions, decisions . . . :confused:

I find it interesting that the writer at LL mentioned only Canon by comparison, as it seems like there is very little qualification there to judge comparative merits in the market place. A bit biased in the evaluation.

No mention of the *ist DS, K-M 7D, or the D70. Pretty curious for an unbiased review.