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mailman95
02-08-2005, 01:46 PM
I just purchased a new Canon EOS 20D, my first DSLR. I have been messing around with a few test shots in full auto mode the last few days and the pictures look great when I review then on the lcd. My problem is when I put them on the computer or print them they are alot darker. I find that I have to adjust the brightness with photoshop about 50% to get the shots to look good.

Does anyone else have this problem? Is there something I'm not getting right? I don't mind tweaking some pics when I want a great print but I don't want to adjust every shot I take.

I am using the kit lens, efs 18-55, shot have been both indoor and out, with and without flash.

Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks

ktixx
02-08-2005, 05:32 PM
I have the 20D, but have only taken 1 or 2 shots on Auto. I usually just shoot in manual mode. I have never experienced a problem like you describe. A suggestion might be to take a look at the brightness setting on your cameras LCD. You might also want to look at how the camera is reading the light. depending on the types of shots you are taking, it might be exposing the shot for a bright light in your picture. I will test my 20D when I get a chance and get back to you.
Ken

jlo
02-17-2005, 07:47 PM
I had a similar problem that turned out to be my computer and the color profiles of my monitor. That also had an affect on the information my computer sent to the printer. I'm not an expert in this area at all, but maybe your problem is related to this.

TheObiJuan
02-17-2005, 09:09 PM
have you tried printing from another source?
perhaps adoramapix, walmart.com, or even wallgreens?

ReF
02-18-2005, 07:29 PM
i say that the monitor/computer settings are not set properly. there is a thread about this under Canon > a75 dark pics when transfer to pc. i calibrated my monitor/computer/display settings on computers and now what i see on the computer matches what i see from my TV, printer, LCD, and the other computer as well. the display on the LCD is still a little brighter than the rest, which is normal, but the difference is minimal.

TenD
02-19-2005, 12:56 AM
Read the histogram on your camera to determine if the pictures are exposed correctly. Just looking at the LCD postview is not enought to determine if a picture is exposed correctly. Read this: http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorials/understanding-series/understanding-histograms.shtml
If you monitor is out of calibration, it would affect your print quality only if you edited your photo to match your poorly calibrated monitor, ie. your monitor was calibrated way too brightly and you darkened the picture so it looked good on your monitor, then you would try to print it and it would print darkly. Your Monitor calibration is very necessary to allow you to edit a file and have your editing be printed accurately.
http://www.normankoren.com/makingfineprints1A.html
Your printer could be out of calibration, it will print the file as it comes from the camera if you don't do any post processing on it. If your printer is out of calibration it might print darkly.
From your post though, you say it looks dark on your monitor and prints darkly, I deduce the file is underexposed. Exposing using the histogram will be the best starting point, having a file you know is exposed properly will let you determine where the problem lies.

charles
02-21-2005, 07:29 AM
look this may be the right answer...
i am guessing you r taking the pics in jpeg, now all the photos are going to be RGB pictures but when you are printing them you must print as CMYK and also adjust the dpi so the pics look great.
if you print in RGB you are never going to see the pictures printed as the ones you see on the LCD.
charles.

Mark_48
02-22-2005, 04:52 PM
I just purchased a new Canon EOS 20D, my first DSLR. I have been messing around with a few test shots in full auto mode the last few days and the pictures look great when I review then on the lcd. My problem is when I put them on the computer or print them they are alot darker. I find that I have to adjust the brightness with photoshop about 50% to get the shots to look good.

Does anyone else have this problem? Is there something I'm not getting right? I don't mind tweaking some pics when I want a great print but I don't want to adjust every shot I take.

I am using the kit lens, efs 18-55, shot have been both indoor and out, with and without flash.

Any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks

Was it mostly indoor flash shots that were dark?

I've had my 20D for a few weeks now and started off with alot of outdoor shots that the exposures were just where I thought they should be. This last week I tried the 20D indoors with the on camera flash as well as a Canon 420EX flash. Both in Basic modes and the Creative modes most shots came out slightly under exposed. In the Creative there is a function called FEC (Flash Exposure Compensation) that allows you to adjust the flash exposures +/- 2 stops. A +1 adjustment to FEC brought the exposures in where they should be for my flash. There is no FEC in Basic modes - you apparently get what you get.
After alot of Google searches and discussion on another forum, it appears under exposure with flash in the Basic modes is fairly common, both with the on camera flash as well as external. Most recommendations I got were to not use Basic modes. I normally don't, but my better half is a point and shoot type and for the times she picks up the camera, Basic (P&S) modes are a disappointment. I emailed Canon twice clearly explaining my issue with Basic modes and flash and on both counts I got back misinformation or they appeared not to want to discuss specifically what I asked - sort of generic answers. I'm going to try a phone call next, although I've been told the help that way isn't a whole lot better.

Has anyone else here run into problems with flash in the basic modes? My DRebel with the old E-TTL actually seems to handle flash better in Basic modes than the 20D :eek:

BobbyT
02-23-2005, 07:05 AM
Charles

It was my impression that CMYK is only used for images that are sent to a printer for off-set printing etc. Would you please verify your info? All my printing at home is done using the Adobe RGB colorspace. ;)

speaklightly
02-23-2005, 05:49 PM
Folks-

As a Canon EOS 20D digital camera owner myself, I would like to offer some observations:

(1) Canon EOS 20D images really deserve being tweaked in a good software program such as Adobe Photoshop Elements 2.0 or Microsoft's Digital Image Pro, Version 10.

(2) Canon EOS 20D images right out of the digital camera, are a bit "flat." They need a bit of help from high quality software programs.

Speaklightly

angelomb3
03-20-2005, 09:55 PM
had the same problem with my 20D. The Histogram showed a bit underexposure so i brought it to my local Canon service center and showed it to them. They did some calibration and now my 20D is doing great..

Mark_48
03-21-2005, 05:48 AM
had the same problem with my 20D. The Histogram showed a bit underexposure so i brought it to my local Canon service center and showed it to them. They did some calibration and now my 20D is doing great..

How long did the calibration take and did they charge anything (in or out of warranty?) to have it done. I presume it was simply tweaking the firmware and not having to disassemble the camera.

Bob Bowen
03-25-2005, 03:18 AM
Read the histogram on your camera to determine if the pictures are exposed correctly. Just looking at the LCD postview is not enought to determine if a picture is exposed correctly. Read this: http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorials/understanding-series/understanding-histograms.shtml
If you monitor is out of calibration, it would affect your print quality only if you edited your photo to match your poorly calibrated monitor, ie. your monitor was calibrated way too brightly and you darkened the picture so it looked good on your monitor, then you would try to print it and it would print darkly. Your Monitor calibration is very necessary to allow you to edit a file and have your editing be printed accurately.
http://www.normankoren.com/makingfineprints1A.html
Your printer could be out of calibration, it will print the file as it comes from the camera if you don't do any post processing on it. If your printer is out of calibration it might print darkly.
From your post though, you say it looks dark on your monitor and prints darkly, I deduce the file is underexposed. Exposing using the histogram will be the best starting point, having a file you know is exposed properly will let you determine where the problem lies.

Thanks for the information, I'm new here and am just starting to get into this area, I am learning a lot, actually, I have to print the articles because of the overwhelming volume of info available in this forum. Thanks again.

Bob Bowen Durand Mi USA

JChampion
03-25-2005, 09:08 AM
Hi,
I seem to have the same problem. My 20D takes excellent pictures outdoors, or in good lighting, but the flash pictures are dark and drab. This is using the built-in flash or the 420EX. I just did a test and the histogram shows that the upper two sections are empty (so the whole histogram is in the darker three sections). I can adjust the exposure level, but I don't want to do that for outdoor shots, just the flash exposures. Any suggestions?
Thanks,
John

Mark_48
03-25-2005, 10:09 AM
John,

Theres a setting you can make on the 20D called "Flash Exposure Compensation" (FEC). This is explained on page 96 of the manual. With my 420EX, I had to bump up this setting a couple of points to get good exposures. Somewhat trial and error. This setting only affects the flash and not exposures made without.
Also I've heard of others who have made changes to Custom Function 14 which affects how the metering for the flash is measured, either evaluative or averaged. I haven't tried this out yet, as the FEC adjustment brought the exposures into where I think they should be.

Mark.........

spots
06-03-2005, 07:23 PM
I'm posting because I had a very similar problem with my 20D to what's been posted here and I found a lot of of help on various forums, this one included, so I thought it was only right that I post my own experience and how the problem was resolved. (Boy, the posting area is a bummer, isn't it -- can't see what the heck I'm writing. I'll do my best, but bear with me.)

To make a longish story a bit shorter, I got a new 20D two weeks ago and found that flash exposure was, well, wanting to say the least. After poking around a bit and trying all sorts of things, and spending an hour communing with Canon tech support (which, BTW, was very responsive, though not definitive), I returned the camera for replacement. The following explanation for the return, which I sent back with the camera, summarizes what the situation was. Sorry about the line breaks; this was pasted from the text of the explanation:


Camera underexposes normal flash in all picture modes. By normal flash I mean
flash without flash exposure compensation or flash exposure lock.

Amount of underexposure varies with subject matter but is usually in the range
of approximately 1 to 1 1/2 stops.

Flash compensation of approximately +1 to +1 1/2 stops exposes correctly in most
situations.

Flash exposure lock exposes correctly with no flash compensation. However, when
used along with (positive) flash compensation, flash exposure lock overexposes
by approximately the amount of the compensation.

In short, practically speaking one must always use either exposure compensation
or exposure lock but not both for correct flash exposure, which means of course
that exposure lock is not available with flash compensation and vice-versa.

Flash underexposes by approximately 1 to 1 1/2 stops in auto modes, where exposure
compensation and flash exposure lock are not available. That is, it is
impossible to take correctly exposed flash pictures in any auto mode.

These results are the same for both an external Canon 420EX Speedlite (both
direct and bounce flash) and for the built-in flash on the camera.

Canon technical support verifies this is not correct behavior for the 20D.

End of explanation
------------

I received the replacement two days ago, and it is an entirely different camera. Flash exposure is dead-on. I'm almost tempted to say I can't fool it, but of course I can if I try, but I really have to try. Flash exposure lock yields precisely the same exposure as normal flash unless the picture is recomposed after locking. Flash pictures in all auto modes are as near perfect as you can expect from any auto mode.

I've used many film SLRs over the years, but I'm digitally relatively inexperienced, now moving up from a G3 to the 20D after 2 1/2 years. I was extremely impressed by the flash exposure capability of the G3 (with 420EX in particular), so the first 20D was a major setback. Not so the replacement. It is easily the equal and possibly the superior of my G3 in flash exposure.

In short, if you're having 20D problems with flash exposure, I'm reporting that it Does Not Have To Be. You DO have a faulty camera, or at least a mis-adjusted one. Exchange it if you can or get it adjusted by Canon if you can't. (The adjustment advice is based on what others have reported on various web forums, not my own experience, but it's been reported in several places that Canon will calibrate the 20D under warrantee to fix problems such as this.)

In case you read this message elsewhere, I'm posting it on several web forums where I found sufferers of similar problems and/or advice on fixing them because I really appreciated the help I got when I needed it. So I think it's only fitting that I post the fact that there is a solution to be had.

BTW, I bought my 20D from Adorama, my first purchase from them, and they were wonderful to deal with. Replaced it without hesitation and extended the two-week trial period on the whole order from the time I received the replacement.

No, I have NO affiliation with Adorama (my first dealing with 'em, as I said). I just appreciate the great service in a stressful time. It isn't every day, or even every decade, that I drop four figures on a camera. In this case, four figures beginning with 2, owing to the 17-85mm IS lens <g>. First time in my life for this level of expense.

Spots

quberoot
06-04-2005, 06:44 AM
Here is something you might like to try.

First set the camera (If its on your Canon) to "Color space" to Adobe RGB, take a flash photo and upload it to Paintshop pro (If you have it) If you have to do an image re-size make sure the "Resize all layers" & "Maintain aspect ratio of" are ticked, this way you don't lose quality when resizing.

If the photo is dark as you say, use the automatic color balance and automatic contrast afterwards. This should bring the photo to a reasonable level to print out. You may also have to sharpen the photo once only.

Hope this helps.

Quby