Recomendations on starter lenses & access. for a Nikon D80?

[CorduroyKM]

Hey there! It was suggested I move this over here so here I am! Ok, so I have a ton of questions - please forgive me. I'm new to all this DSLR, after putting my N80 35mm to rest for now, so it's a HUGE help!

1 - Just wondering what you would recomend for starter lenses on the D80 I'll be buying this Saturday :). I've been reading reviews on the 18/55mm kit lenses and I'm torn. Originally I was just going to go with a D80 body and then the 18-200mm VR AF-S lense but I read that you give up a fair amt in pic quality for the convienence of carrying 1 all purpose lens. I think I'd rather have 2 good lenses and deal with cleaning out the dust.

The 18-55mm EII AF-S lense got great reviews for putting out really nice sharp pictures. But they also have the newer version with VR (but no EII glass) and they say it's the same in the stores but the reviews say "only time will tell." Any advice on which to buy? Willing to spend as much a $1200 on any combination ... for now ... :).

2 - I'm also looking for a basic zoom lense and was thinking of the 55-200mm VR AF-S. Any suggestions? I know this is vague but I'll be using the camera mostly for travel (Hawaii in May!!:D), family, street shots in NYC where I live, landscapes & the occasional tennis match.

3 - I was going to buy the D60 because it came with the antidust feature but the D80 is a better camera for my needs. How do I clean the dust from it since it doesn't have the antidust feature? Just a simple blower like the Giottos rocket I saw? I'm afraid I might go into my camera to clean it and damage it!

4 - What size memory card should I buy? I've always been happy with SanDisk and was thinking an 8GB but someone told me that might be too small if I shoot RAW files. I don't do a ton of editing so I thought maybe it would work if I just shoot to JPGS?

Is this even making sense? I'm so new to all this and I feel like I'm learning a new language!

Thanks in advance,
KM

[Tony_V]

1 - Just wondering what you would recomend for starter lenses on the D80 I'll be buying this Saturday :). I've been reading reviews on the 18/55mm kit lenses and I'm torn. Originally I was just going to go with a D80 body and then the 18-200mm VR AF-S lense but I read that you give up a fair amt in pic quality for the convienence of carrying 1 all purpose lens. I think I'd rather have 2 good lenses and deal with cleaning out the dust.

The 18-55mm EII AF-S lense got great reviews for putting out really nice sharp pictures. But they also have the newer version with VR (but no EII glass) and they say it's the same in the stores but the reviews say "only time will tell." Any advice on which to buy? Willing to spend as much a $1200 on any combination ... for now ... :).

The 18-55mm Kit lens is a good starter lens. So is the 18-135mm lens and both can be had in a Kit with the D80. I've used both of these (non VR) and both produce good image quality especially for the price. I own a Tamron 17-50mm F2.8 lens which I like. This lens is faster than the kit lenses and not much price difference over the 18-135mm. Sigma also makes a lens in this range that folks here like. The 18-200mm is a good walk around lens. There has been a lot of image quality discussion here but If you read through some of the threads here you will see that the image quality is very good. I prefer 2 lenses to cover that range. Changing lenses can introduce dirt but I have had my D80 for about a year and a half, I changes lenses all the time and I haven't had an issue with dirt (knock on wood). The more careful you are the less of an issue it will be.


2 - I'm also looking for a basic zoom lense and was thinking of the 70-200mm VR AF-S. Any suggestions? I know this is vague but I'll be using the camera mostly for travel (Hawaii in May!!:D), family, street shots in NYC where I live, landscapes & the occasional tennis match.

I wouldn't call the $1600 70-200mm AF-S VR lens a basic zoom lens. I also wouldn't necessarily use if for everything you mention above: Travel - probably but I don't mind its size and weight, Family - candid outdoor shots, Street shots in NYC - maybe, Landscapes - probably not, and the tennis match is where this lens would do best. If you don't mind its price, size and weight there is no better lens in its range. A friend of mine has owned this lens for years and loves it. When he went to Europe over the summer he purchased a 70-300 f4.5-5.6 VR lens for the trip because he didn't want to carry the 'big gun'. That may be an option for you and it is about 1/4 the price.


3 - I was going to buy the D60 because it came with the antidust feature but the D80 is a better camera for my needs. How do I clean the dust from it since it doesn't have the antidust feature? Just a simple blower like the Giottos rocket I saw? I'm afraid I might go into my camera to clean it and damage it!

Can't help you here...that's a bridge I haven't had to cross yet.


4 - What size memory card should I buy? I've always been happy with SanDisk and was thinking an 8GB but someone told me that might be too small if I shoot RAW files. I don't do a ton of editing so I thought maybe it would work if I just shoot to JPGS?

The D80 can take a maximum 8GB SDHC card. I have 2 GB cards and 4 GB cards. I mostly shoot RAW + medium size jpeg and normal compression. On the 2 GB card I get about 150 images to a card. So that would work out to about 600 on an 8 GB card. If you have a place to dump your images, a few 4 GB cards would be the way I would go. You can usually pickup 2- 4 GB cards for less than 1- 8GB card.

Hope that helped.
Tony

[Visual Reality]

I was not impressed by the reviews of the 18-200, at all...the 18-55 is much better optically.

For zooms, both the 55-200 and the 70-300 are great. The 70-300 is of course the best of the two, and the price is proportionately higher so you can decide what you want to spend.

[Grapedog]

No disrespect to the OP, but if you are buying now why are you buying a D80?

I know your question is about lenses, and I will get there but hear me out.

The differences between D60 and D80 are:

D80 has focus motor: D60 does not.
Most consumer lenses nowadays are Af-S {the dash-S being important because they have focus motors built in and can be used on everything Nikonian}

D60 has the latest iteration of the Expeed processing. Ergo IQ would be better than D80, I presume. {let the uproar begin}

D60 is cheaper.

D60 has dust reduction features to help out with the dust issues caused during the changing of lenses.

Seems to me that the D80 is a lame duck. If it were cheaper than the D60, then all bets are off and you could make a cost/benefit calculation.


But given that most of the consumer lenses that you asked about are mostly af-s, the lone drawback to the D60 is not relevant.


Thom Hogan has DX lens reviews here: http://www.bythom.com/DigRecs.htm


With a 18-200 VR DX Af-s you are off to a good start for under $700.

[tfa8rva]

You forgot that the D80 has a second control wheel in the front for aperture, DOF Preview, 11 AF Points, and it auto focuses primes and maybe some lenses that came with the N80...not sure about that last one.

[erichlund]

The D60 is an entry level camera. The D80 is a mid level enthusiast camera. It has better controls and, used in RAW, will probably match the D60 for image quality. Yeah, the D60 has a bunch of new bells and whistles, but if you really want those, and you want more than a beginner camera, then it's D80, D300, or wait for the D90.

The OP has been using an SLR for years, so I have no problem recommending the D80. It's still a great camera, and it still has significant advantages over the entry level cameras for the experienced user. Most significant of these is not being limited to AF-S lenses, of which he may already have some.

[ssil2000]

No disrespect to the OP, but if you are buying now why are you buying a D80?

I know your question is about lenses, and I will get there but hear me out.

The differences between D60 and D80 are:

D80 has focus motor: D60 does not.
Most consumer lenses nowadays are Af-S {the dash-S being important because they have focus motors built in and can be used on everything Nikonian}

D60 has the latest iteration of the Expeed processing. Ergo IQ would be better than D80, I presume. {let the uproar begin}

D60 is cheaper.

D60 has dust reduction features to help out with the dust issues caused during the changing of lenses.

Seems to me that the D80 is a lame duck. If it were cheaper than the D60, then all bets are off and you could make a cost/benefit calculation.


But given that most of the consumer lenses that you asked about are mostly af-s, the lone drawback to the D60 is not relevant.


Thom Hogan has DX lens reviews here: http://www.bythom.com/DigRecs.htm


With a 18-200 VR DX Af-s you are off to a good start for under $700.

thats a pretty bold misinformed statement. a d80 is still a class above a d60, a focus motor is a pretty important feature considering nikkor primes wont af on d60 not to mention the OP has a nikon slr which i am sure he has lens(es) for and without a d80 it will be manual focus all the way. also the 11 af points which i personally find very handy and make it a lot easier to track... next time think about what you are saying we are here to help people not to confuse or insult them.

as for the op, the d80 with 18-55mm EII AF-S would be a great starting point, i have that lens and am very happy with its performance.

as for a basic zoom, the 70-200 vr is by no means basic, it is probably nikons best zoom lens bar none. if you can afford it and the size/weight isnt an issue then by all means go for it! as for entry level there have been a few good suggestions already :)

as for dust removal rocket blower is a great investment and software will always help you remove those dust specs :)

as for memory card, i shoot raw and get 150ish pics out of my 2gb so i carry 2x2gbs which i have struggled to fill on any given day. now you mentioned you are going on holidays so you may benefit from a larger memory card, the only issue i have with large 8gb memory cards, you end up getting 600 shots to sort through instead of 150 every time you fill your memory card, personal preference i guess :)

as for raw vs jpeg, i started shooting jpeg then raw+jpeg then realized that raw gives you a lot more control over your picture, so i only shoot raw now. the amount of things you can change on a raw image compared to jpeg makes it totally worth while. all of the setting you set in camera that are "software" based can be changed without damaging the raw image in PP.

hope some of this helps and enjoy your d80!

Sergio

[jcon]

thats a pretty bold misinformed statement. a d80 is still a class above a d60, a focus motor is a pretty important feature considering nikkor primes wont af on d60

I agree! Where were you when the D40 came out and myself along with Coldrain, Rooz, Tcad and a few others were informing prospective D40 owners the downfall of not having the focus motor, only to have the D40 owners jump all over us... we couldve used your backing!! :D:p

[Visual Reality]

as for memory card, i shoot raw and get 150ish pics out of my 2gb so i carry 2x2gbs which i have struggled to fill on any given day. now you mentioned you are going on holidays so you may benefit from a larger memory card, the only issue i have with large 8gb memory cards, you end up getting 600 shots to sort through instead of 150 every time you fill your memory card, personal preference i guess :)
I have this same problem. I tend to fill whatever size card I have, and sometimes wish it were smaller so I would stop shooting! It takes forever to sort through 4GB of 6.0MP JPEGs...god forbid I also fill my other 4GB card as well...which I have done several times.

[ssil2000]

I agree! Where were you when the D40 came out and myself along with Coldrain, Rooz, Tcad and a few others were informing prospective D40 owners the downfall of not having the focus motor, only to have the D40 owners jump all over us... we couldve used your backing!! :D:p

hehe ;)
well, to add to that slightly, budget has a big part in it too in this case the op seems to have a d80 well in his budget so going backwards doesnt seem logical to me... anyhoo enough from me :)

[e_dawg]

I was not impressed by the reviews of the 18-200, at all...the 18-55 is much better optically.

Um, no. The main weakness of the 18-200 is that it can get a bit soft at the long end (above 135 mm). Other than that, it's just fine optically, and can compete with the 18-55 kit lens no problem. Not to mention, when you start shooting in lower light conditions and you struggle to get blur-free shots with the 18-55, the 18-200 will allow someone else to keep shooting happily with blur-free pics.


D60 has the latest iteration of the Expeed processing. Ergo IQ would be better than D80, I presume. {let the uproar begin}

For JPEGs, yes. For RAW, no.

Another couple big differences between the D80 and the D60 that haven't been mentioned yet: the much better grip on the D80, which is useful for handling larger/heavier lenses, and the built-in CLS wireless flash commander system, which is a great way of controlling multiple flashes wirelessly. If you get to the "next level" where you shoot with your own multi-flash lighting setups for studio work or in the field, you'll appreciate this quick and easy feature.

[e_dawg]

Personally, my favourite all-purpose / starter lens for the D80 is the Tamron 17-50/2.8. Sharp corner to corner at every focal length and aperture. Nice and fast (well, not necessarily fast, but much better than f/3.5-5.6 zooms) at f/2.8 too. AF is quick but noisy. If you get version II of the Tamron, it will have a built-in AF motor too, which can be used with the D40-D60 bodies.

The other lens I would recommend is the new 16-85/VR. The widest all-purpose zoom you can get. VR II gets you 3-4 stops. Should be quite good optically. Main drawback is the high price, and not as fast as a f/2.8 lens (but smaller and lighter).

[CorduroyKM]

First off - you guys are hillarious and I love that everyone has such stong opinions. Thank you sooo much for all your advice and suggestions!

Just to clarify...
- I'm a he, not a she - Kate :p Workin on updating my profile & learning the lingo here still!

- I was considering the D60 for a while before it came out and I do love that it's lighter but I have a 50mm lense that I can only use in manual with that and I'm used to my N80 which has the 2 wheels sooo when you add that to all the other many reasons (ie. just came out might have some bugs, 11pt focus system on the d80 ...) - I'm not sure it's the best camera for me to "grow" with - but let me know if you think otherwise. I will be using it a lot in manual when I take a digital SLR class this summer.

- Re: the 70-200 lense I was thinking of was a typo - and WHAT a typo!! My appologies - I meant the 55-200mm f/4-5.6G ED AF-S VR ($250). I just looked up the other one and oh boy! I was thinking of the DX version of a lense I have for my 35mm. You were all right - that 70-200 was def not a basic!!

Does this help clarify? :)

[Visual Reality]

Um, no. The main weakness of the 18-200 is that it can get a bit soft at the long end (above 135 mm). Other than that, it's just fine optically, and can compete with the 18-55 kit lens no problem. Not to mention, when you start shooting in lower light conditions and you struggle to get blur-free shots with the 18-55, the 18-200 will allow someone else to keep shooting happily with blur-free pics.
We are talking about two lenses with VR here. There will be hardly any difference at all in low-light shooting.

[XaiLo]

B&H has the D80 body for $729 & the Tamron 17-50/2.8 for $419. Well within your budget and it would pair up nicely with the 70-200mm VR which is also 2.8 throughout. the 18-55mm is a decent lens and good performer if you check the " Some D40 Pics thread all of my images up to page 19 were shot with it.

Edit: CorduroyKM, you posted while I was checking prices but that combo would still work with the 55-200mm. and stick with the 11 focus points. :)

[K1W1]

First off - you guys are hillarious and I love that everyone has such stong opinions.

Just wait until something contentious comes up. You ain't seen anything close to strong opinions yet. :D

Welcome BTW.

Now that we have all told you what to do just go out buy the D80 and start posting pictures so we can get stuck into you about over exposure or lens flair or poor cropping or the other really good stuff. :D

[T06]

Don't listen to these a/holes, they know nothing!!!!:D Go out & buy the 70-200 VR & then save some more, we know how to spend others money.:D:D;)
Seriously, don't get your knickers in a twist & think that as soon as you take the lens off the front of the camera that all hell breaks loose & all the floating crap in the room is magnetized onto your sensor. If you are to change a lens then put the camera body down with the lens opening on the bottom, also remember to hold a lens level while you are changing it, up & down will let dust settle on it 200+%, put the end caps on the changed lens & then attach the new lens. Your sensor isn't made of glass that will shatter the moment you breath on it, just be gentle with it as once it's scratched it's pretty well gorn!

[Tony_V]

- I was considering the D60 for a while before it came out and I do love that it's lighter but I have a 50mm lense that I can only use in manual with that and I'm used to my N80 which has the 2 wheels sooo when you add that to all the other many reasons (ie. just came out might have some bugs, 11pt focus system on the d80 ...) - I'm not sure it's the best camera for me to "grow" with - but let me know if you think otherwise. I will be using it a lot in manual when I take a digital SLR class this summer.

In your first post you stated you decided on the D80. The reasoning above is a perfect reason to stick with that decision. I am not knocking D40 or D60 owners. In my opinion you have SLR experience with the N80 so the D80 is a better choice to grow with. Not to mention the Lens you have from the N80 that won't auto focus on the D60.

As far as lenses, in my opinion there haven't been any bad suggestions in this thread. The 18-200mm is a compromise; one lens for image quality at either end. Still many folks like it. All the lenses mentioned in this thread will give good image quality. Usually the more expensive the lens the better the IQ (but not always). The 18-55mm kit lens is good, the Tamron 17-50 F2.8 is better. The 55-200mm VR is very good for the price. The 70-300mm VR is better. None of these lenses will keep you from taking good pictures; go look the picture of the day thread to see what I mean. My experience has shown me if I am considering 2 lenses and the more expensive lens is the one I really want, I will wait until I can afford it before plunking down my cash.

Also, something worth mentioning is you can rent many lenses. Another Photographer turned me on to this as a try before you buy approach. Buy what you need an then rent and play...

Once again, I hope this helped and good luck with your decision and purchase.

Tony

[e_dawg]

We are talking about two lenses with VR here. There will be hardly any difference at all in low-light shooting.

I didn't know you were talking about the VR version, as there was no mention of "VR" in your post. I thought you were responding to Tony's recommendation of the 18-200, where he discussed the non-VR 18-55 along with the 18-200...


The 18-55mm Kit lens is a good starter lens. So is the 18-135mm lens and both can be had in a Kit with the D80. I've used both of these (non VR) and both produce good image quality especially for the price. [...] The 18-200mm is a good walk around lens. There has been a lot of image quality discussion here but If you read through some of the threads here you will see that the image quality is very good.

--------------------------

Although, I do suspect the 18-200/VR will perform a bit better in low light than the 18-55/VR as it has VR II as opposed to VR I. About 1 stop more effective. I don't know whether that constitutes "hardly any difference", but it is a small but notable difference IMO...

[CorduroyKM]

Alright - I'm off to buy my D80!! Thanks again for all your help!! I can't wait to start shooting and posting some photos!! :)