Are the Panasonics really that bad in low light?

[Jen3n8]

I've been researching the cameras before making my first digital camera purchase and have read that the Panasonics, I'm looking at FZ20 or the FZ3, aren't the best in low light situations. My requirements for the new camera are at least 3 megapixels and at least 5x optical zoom. And since a lot of my picture taking will be inside of night clubs (will be taking pics of bands while onstage), I want to make sure I purchase a camera that will work on these shots. I really like the FZ20 but am worried that it won't take the pics I need. Can you offer your opinions?

[John_Reed]

I've been researching the cameras before making my first digital camera purchase and have read that the Panasonics, I'm looking at FZ20 or the FZ3, aren't the best in low light situations. My requirements for the new camera are at least 3 megapixels and at least 5x optical zoom. And since a lot of my picture taking will be inside of night clubs (will be taking pics of bands while onstage), I want to make sure I purchase a camera that will work on these shots. I really like the FZ20 but am worried that it won't take the pics I need. Can you offer your opinions?If your shots are to be taken in darkness, any camera would have some trouble. But in "Night Club" lighting, your subjects aren't usually in darkness, in fact they're usually under spotlights, allowing shutter speeds in the 1/25 range. In this environment, an FZ20 excels, bringing not only its fast f2.8 12X lens to the party, but also its image stabilization, which will let you take those slow shots with confidence of getting some sharp results.

[Payne]

Taking pics of bands while onstage might be a bit difficult to any DC with small sensor, since what you need to avoid blurry pictures (without flash) is to set fast shutter speeds equivalent to 1/200 at least ...you are gonna be able to get that setting through high Isos (400 or higher)......but the higher Iso the higher noise level you get unless you use a DRSRL. IMHO, you should go with a 300D, Nikon D70, Pentax IstdS or Oly E300, which delivery almost noise free images even at Iso 400.....but have in mind that you'll also need an additional budget for interchangeable lenses.....
The Pana FZ20 is an outstanding camera, above all for outdoor shots but I think a DSRL fit with your needs.

Regards,

[jcon]

I myself had the same struggle before purchasing the FZ20. I am very happy that I decided to go with the FZ20 and I think you would too. A member here of the forum (FZ20knowitall) posted some pictures that he took at a concert. They looked great! And if I remember correctly the singer even used one of the pictures for promotional purposes, so to answer your question, YES the FZ20 will suit you needs! Please let us know what you decide and what your thoughts are on the camera once you buy it :)

[jcon]

I just found the picture I mentioned in my previous post. It is courtesy of fz20knowitall.......

http://public.fotki.com/fz20knowitall/fz20_sample_images/jason_brody_2.html


You ofcourse might get different results depending on your settings.

[24Peter]

The only "problem" with the FZ 20 in low light shooting situations is the dim LCD and EVF. This makes framing/composing the shot difficult (if it's dark enough the viewfinders are actually black and you can't see anything even though it's easy to see your subject with the naked eye.) Hence the suggestion that Panasonic add a gain up feature to the viewfinders in the future. Once you get past this, the camera operates as well as (and perhaps better than) other similar cameras. (Some have suggested using a flashlight to illuminate your subject prior to shooting.)

If your subject is up on a stage or otherwise under lights, then it's no problem as you'll have a clear image to use in the viewfinders. Just set an appropriate shutter/apeture and take your shot and if necessary use a tripod or other stabilizer.

[LStoner]

I am so happy I purchased the FZ20. I bought it specifically in mind of taking concert pics because I heard that it excelled in low-light. I have great photos from 2 concerts I went to using the FZ20. Don't let low-light worries be a negative factor in buying this camera. At least for me, it has not been an issue.

-Lee Ann

[jaynads]

I am so happy I purchased the FZ20. I bought it specifically in mind of taking concert pics because I heard that it excelled in low-light. I have great photos from 2 concerts I went to using the FZ20. Don't let low-light worries be a negative factor in buying this camera. At least for me, it has not been an issue.

-Lee Ann
The major complaint I've seen is that the LCD doesn't gain up. The only time I've encountered a problem is shooting in such low light even I couldn't make out detail. In what most people consider low light (needing a tripod, despite image stabilization), the camera handles very well. Personally, I only think the LCD should gain up when the flash is on, otherwise, I like seeing before I take the picture what I expect to get.

[Jen3n8]

If your subject is up on a stage or otherwise under lights, then it's no problem as you'll have a clear image to use in the viewfinders. Just set an appropriate shutter/apeture and take your shot and if necessary use a tripod or other stabilizer.

Thanks for everyone's input but now I have another question in regards to setting the shutter/apeture during a concert type setting. I'm a novice photographer and have only ever used a point and shoot camera. This would be my first at having to use some manual settings. Any help in the matter would be much appreciated. The concerts would be in small clubs and bars as my brother's band is just getting started. I'm trying to get some good pics for their website. Thanks!

[John_Reed]

Thanks for everyone's input but now I have another question in regards to setting the shutter/apeture during a concert type setting. I'm a novice photographer and have only ever used a point and shoot camera. This would be my first at having to use some manual settings. Any help in the matter would be much appreciated. The concerts would be in small clubs and bars as my brother's band is just getting started. I'm trying to get some good pics for their website. Thanks!
1) First of all, you'll want to shoot at maximum aperture to get the most light through the lens while the shutter is open. So go to A on the mode dial (for Aperture priority), and, using the "exposure" button, set the aperture to f2.8.

2) Then I'd suggest you go into the "record" (shooting) mode, and push the "up" button on the 4-way switch, which will show you an "EV" scale. While you're there, nudge the button to the left a little, to select -1/3 to -2/3 EV exposure "bias." This will speed up the shutter too.

3) Select "Manual" white balance from the WB menu, and set the WB using a white card illuminated by the stage lighting (a white shirt will work too, just zoom in so that the white fills the screen). I'm assuming that all or most of your photos will be by "available light," and not using the camera's flash.

4) Start with Auto ISO set on the menu. If you decide that ISO 400 photos are too noisy for you, select ISO 200 instead of Auto.

That'd be my take on your best shooting parameters. Read the manual if any of the above was confusing. Good luck!

[Jen3n8]

I want to thank everyone for their opinions and help! I'm still trying to decide on the camera. I'm pretty sure it will be a Panasonic. I really love the FZ20 but I was trying to keep the purchase under $600 (including accessories). I'm thinking I may go with the FZ3, just a little unsure if it would be worth the money since it's only 3 mps. I was hoping that Panasonic would announce a new camera at last week's trade show in Vegas so that the FZ20 would go down in price. ;)

Do y'all think I'd be making a mistake by downgrading to the FZ3? I really would like to get the camera soon but if I'll regret the purchase and wished I'd bought the FZ20 I guess I can find some patience somewhere long enough to save the extra cash...

[jcon]

If youre looking to save a few bucks I would suggest maybe you can take a look the the FZ15. It is pretty much the same camera as the FZ20. The FZ15 doesnt have a hotshoe for an external flash(deal breaker for me), does not have a microphone and is 4MP compared to the 5MP the FZ20 offers. Other than those few things I believe they are the same camera at about a $150 price difference. If you do not really need those extra features the FZ20 offers, maybe the FZ15 would be better for you. Etronics.com currently has the FZ15 listed at $390. I have bought my FZ20 from them and a few other big money purchases and they are wonderful! If you do buy from them, they are too expensive on the accesories. You can buy them somewhere else for cheaper. If money doesnt matter, go with the FZ20, you wont regret it! I hope this has helped!

[60mm]

I dont mean to bethe party pooper, but the FZ serires are not really ideal for low-light no flash photograpghy, this is DSLR territory. I know the extra $$$ sucks, but theres no way around it. For really good photos, ISO 200 can scrape by on myFZ20 sometimes. Repeat sometimes. ISO 400 is useless. Look at some low range DSLRs like the D70 that goes no lower than 200 and is smoother at 1600 than the FZ20 is at 400!!! If you are serious at getting low light stuff w/o flash, save up for a DSLR. Heck you could land a Canon Digital Rebel for only a couple hundred more.

[sgoldste01]

I dont mean to bethe party pooper, but the FZ serires are not really ideal for low-light no flash photograpghy, this is DSLR territory. I know the extra $$$ sucks, but theres no way around it. For really good photos, ISO 200 can scrape by on myFZ20 sometimes. Repeat sometimes. ISO 400 is useless. Look at some low range DSLRs like the D70 that goes no lower than 200 and is smoother at 1600 than the FZ20 is at 400!!! If you are serious at getting low light stuff w/o flash, save up for a DSLR. Heck you could land a Canon Digital Rebel for only a couple hundred more.

I haven't researched it too much, but my guess is that your statement isn't completely true. Yes, you can get a Digital Rebel for a couple hundred more, but that price wouldn't include a lense set that's as flexible as the FZ20's. To really equip a Digital Rebel with equivalent functions to the FZ would require a bigger cost delta than you describe.

[frumious]

I dont mean to bethe party pooper, but the FZ serires are not really ideal for low-light no flash photograpghy, this is DSLR territory. I know the extra $$$ sucks, but theres no way around it. For really good photos, ISO 200 can scrape by on myFZ20 sometimes. Repeat sometimes. ISO 400 is useless. Look at some low range DSLRs like the D70 that goes no lower than 200 and is smoother at 1600 than the FZ20 is at 400!!! If you are serious at getting low light stuff w/o flash, save up for a DSLR. Heck you could land a Canon Digital Rebel for only a couple hundred more.

60mm is correct as far as truly low low light situations go. But concerts are not low light. Concert subjects are generally well lit - well withing the parameters of the FZ shooting at 200 ISO. The FZ has a real world advantage over DSLRs in this environment that results in getting the shots a DSLR is less likely to get: It is quicker and nimbler to the shot. The combo of a single lens that goes in three seconds from wide angle to zoom at over 400mm zoom (not counting digital zoom) coupled with the image stabilizer means that you are going to be pulling shot after steady sharp shot while a DSLR photog will switching out lenses and missing the moments. A DSLR shooting with a heavy 400mm lens is no picnic. This is the verdict of buddy of mine who uses a Canon Digital Rebel. And then there is price. The FZ20 street price is around $500. A CDR with lenses to cover the range of the FZ 20 will set you back around $1,500.

[60mm]

As far as cost, you can get a Rebel if you wanted and a decent lens for under a grand. As far as "quicker and nimbler", I know for a fact that the D70 can crack off 12 shots before the FZ20 has finished starting up. Also, if you know youre going to take pics in a low light environment, you would have the right lense on there in the first place, there wouldnt be switching lenses. Are they more combersome yes. As for as zoom speed, a 70-200mm or 70-300mm (more zoom than the FZ20) with manual zoom can go to full telephoto much quicker than the FZ20. Im not trying to bash on the FZ20 because I love mine, but in low light settings, it gets the snot kicked out of it. I just dont want to give advice to someone that gets them a camera they may not be very happy with. As far as a daylight camera, general indoors, whatnot, or anytime with flash this camera is awesome.

[24Peter]

Got my strobe kit today (see http://www.dcresource.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3847) (I'll post a review of the kit soon). The poor low light LCD/EVF viewing rears its ugly head again as follows: the strobes are 110W and pretty bright. In order to get a properly exposed shot, I have to turn the exposure settings way way down (depending on where I place the lights I'm at at least F3.7 and 1/250 shutter speed and sometimes even lower.) Good thing is I don't have to worry about blurry shots with such a fast shutter. Bad news is, in a normally lit room, the viewfinders are black. Can't even aim the thing. Ugghh. The AF assist lamp works wonders but if it weren't for that I wouldn't be able to shoot at all. :( Check that: once the sun went down even the AF assist stopped working. Couldn't frame or focus.