Need advice on companion compact camera to my FZ20

[Cyberwlf]

Hi people

I keep relatively upto date with new camera news and but particularly on new Panasonic models.

What I am in the market for is a compact companion to my existing FZ20. Something preferably pocket size, but i dont mind if it requires a big pocket Don't mind which brand, as long as it's good.

I've seen alot of the different new models from Pana and other companies, and Fuji/Olympus/etc all seem to offer potentially attractive models, but always find things fall down in certain areas to cover my needs.
Ideally i'd like a compact which offers:

Leica lens (or something just as good!)

F2.8->F11 (or higher)

ISO 80/100->800 (or higher)... And it would be nice if ISO >400 was actually usable and not just noisy watercolours

Preferably wide-angle (ie 28mm+)

Don't mind if optical zoom is only 3x

And preferably 6mp+

Don't mind spending a fair bit on it, but the requirement is that it is compact, as i need something more discreet for travelling/backpacking and something i can quickly take out/put away.

Both FX50 and TZ1/TZ3 seem to be hot contenders for this cateogry. But i'm also concerned as I've seen reviews saying the FZ50 has very high noise issues, and TZ3 which seems good in most respects except some reports say it has very noticable barrel distortion.

Thanks for any advice!

[jcon]

A couple things I would like to clarify, if I may.

You mentioned "F2.8->F11 (or higher)"

When you say higher, you mean higher than F11? If so, why? You dont need anything above F11. I think you may have the numbers backwards, what you want is on the low end to be as small a number as possible, like F2.8, that is real good for a compact camera, if you can get under F2.8, thats awesome for low light shooting.

The other thing, you brought up the FZ50 and its noise problems. I thought you wanted a compact camera that would fit in a pocket? The FZ50 is a TANK! It wont fit in anyones pocket! LOL, Oh and yes, the FZ50 is very noisy at mid to high ISO.

I think you will notice that Panasonic offers alot of cameras that will fit the bill for you. I think the TZ models would be a good place to look.

BTW, hang on to that FZ20 as long as you can, its a gem! That constant F2.8 is wonderful to have!

Like I suggest to anyone looking for camera suggestions, go over to PBase.com and look at sample photos other people have taken with the cameras you are considering for purchase.

[Cyberwlf]

Hi Jason, thanks for the reply.

My request regarding aperture is based on my understanding of depth of field theory. From what i understand f/2.8 keeps everything in focus, and as the aperture rises you can keep specific items in focus, so with a wider aperture range you have a wider range of flexibility. So yeah ideally the compact would support f/2.8+, but what i meant is have an f-stop range of say 2.8->11 or (greater). And I've seen on dSLR's that f/11+ is often used to get good low-light shots too.

And regarding FZ50, I actually said FX50 not FZ50, two entirely different animals, the FX50 being the compact Lumix model and the FZ50 being the successor to the FZx0 range (which i presently own)

Thanks

[jcon]

Actually you did mention the FZ50, but I guess it was a typo on your part:D



Both FX50 and TZ1/TZ3 seem to be hot contenders for this cateogry. But i'm also concerned as I've seen reviews saying the FZ50 has very high noise issues, and TZ3 which seems good in most respects except some reports say it has very noticable barrel distortion.

Thanks for any advice!

I think you are really confused about what aperture does. The lower the number the more light gets in but its harder to keep the subject in focus. This causes whats called "bokeh" where only a small part of the picture is in focus and the rest/background is blurry. The higher the number(F11) the more of the picture is sharp and in focus, this is normally used for landsacpe photography. NO! the higher F number does NOT help in low light, its the complete opposite! So to recap, for low light, you want a low number like F2.8 for good lighting or to get more of the picture focuses, you want it higher, like F11. I hope this cleared that up for you:D

I will look to see if I can post an example of Bokeh, gotta get my external drive hooked up.

[Cyberwlf]

Yeah okay, i've never formally studied photography, so my knowledge comes from reading a cross section of photography magazine and photogaphy forums which has left me confused when it comes to aperture ;).

And yeah i wrote FX50 the first time and the FZ50 bit just after it was a typo :P

PS. Re lower f-stop = better low-light, why then does the FZ20 and others like it have such poor low-light performance then? I know setting the f-stop in the FZ20 to f/8 and ISO80 and long exposure (hah 15 seconds) for example allows for better night shots than ISO 400 at f/2.8 seems to produce.

[jcon]

Ok, here is a sample of what bokeh is and wha happens with the lower F number, this pic was taken at F2.8, just now:D so subject matter isnt too impressive. If this were taken with an aperture of F11, most of it would be in focus, including the wrapped present in the background.

I hope I didnt take you off track of your main goal, getting camera suggestions, I just wanted to make sure you understood before you laid down your cash on a camera! Hope I was able to help.

[Cyberwlf]

No you haven't taken me off track at all, if anything a better understanding of this better helps in making a decision. But yeah i remember one of the things people say makes cameras like the FZ20 good is the fact it supports f/2.8 throughout its whole zoom range, yet cameras like TZ3 support only f/3.3+

[jcon]

Exactly right! I wish I hadnt sold my FZ20, it would be nice to take with me where my big DSLRs couldnt go.

Anywho, good luck to you with your camera hunt. I am sure you will get lots of suggestions when the other members are awake, LOL.

[Mike63]

why then does the FZ20 and others like it have such poor low-light performance then?

My FZ-20 does not select iso 400 on it's own when on automatic instead it chooses 200 and then adjusts the shutter speed accordingly. Even if it did the results are poor at 400. I put manually put the camera on 400 for dark shots with no flash then I use a tripod.

Some of the sample photo's from the newer camera models take better pics at high iso's. Jason is right, look at the sample photo's. Try to find some taken at 400 iso or above and see what they look like.

[Cyberwlf]

TZ2/TZ3 seem to finally be some of Pana's first High ISO offerings which hasn't been just watercolours/plagued by noise.

[Mike63]

I agree, the TZ3 has a slightly larger CCD so I am anxious for a review from this site. At this time Jeff does not have the TZ3 on his review list though.:(