Upgrade to FZ50 from FZ15 question

[MacBook]

I am a FZ15 owner who is generally happy with the camera. I am considering the FZ50 for a few reasons, including the lens zoom and other improvements about which I have read. However, I have fears after reading all the discussions about noise.

So, can you have experience with these cameras (or the 20 and 50) give me some guidance as to the downsides of trading up? The FZ50 is about 5.3 ounces heavier and a bit bigger. What other things about it might be less appealing?

[genece]

I have a FZ10 and 20 and a FZ30......IMHO the FZ30/50 are much better cameras than the previous models.......And as far as noise, I used a NR software a good bit on FZ10 and 20 photos because of the noise in low light photos and in the sky. I almost never use a NR program with the FZ30. And I am sure the FZ50 would be the same.

And as many times as I read about the FZ30 being larger , I always used an aftermarket adapter and a lens hood on the FZ10 and 20 and with the hood on a FZ30 they are the same size....I do think the FZ30 is a little heavier but once again considering I used the adapter with the FZ10/20 the weight is very similar.

When I upgraded to the FZ20 the improvement over the FZ10 was very small but the upgrade to the FZ30 was huge.......I can see no downside.

[Pave]

Ah, the noise again...
I was in similar situation as yours an year ago...I was considering buying the FZ30 and I also feared the "noise issue" as it was usually refered to then. In the end I decided to buy the camera and I'm in love with it ever since.
Of course you can't expect the pictures to be completely noise-free especialy in no/lowlight conditions (this never happens) and the ISO400 is pretty useless due to the amount of noise. So I guess that the FZ50's ISO 1600 would be pretty useless as well but if you don't intend to use these high ISOs, the FZ50 is a camera for you. And if you want to use as high ISO as this, go for a DSLR because no P&S or ultrazoom will be good enough for you... :)

[MacBook]

The only other camera I am really considering is the Pentax K100D because it is a DSLR. I know these are very different cameras, and it raises the issue of telephoto and new lenses, etc., and that is why I trying to stay with the one-camera solution. I was surprised to see the camera had gained a little weight in the last couple of years (from the FZ15), but then I suppose I have as well.

Two other questions then: Would you advise a Mack warranty from B&H since the Panasonic's is only 90 days labor? I haven't had any problems with the FZ15, but then again....
The other is whether the Leica V-Lux 1 has proven any better in terms of its firmware or noise. I read conflicting user reports, and I know it's almost twice as much as the Panasonic. I'm just curious what people might have experienced. There doesn't seem to be anything in the Leica forum.

[John_Reed]

Even though the 30 (same size as 50) is bigger than the 15 was, my wife said "It feels smaller!" It has a better balanced grip, and just feels better in our collective hands.

Using the FZ30's manual zoom ring is like a dream compared to the electronic zoom of the FZ15. For one thing, the FZ30 recovers from sleep or power off in < 1 second, whereas the FZ15 took several seconds to recover, especially if you were shooting long zoom shots, which I am prone to do. One frustration completely gone.

As for image quality issues, I had one with the FZ15 that has seemingly been cured with the later models, namely an inability to capture details on red flowers, for one thing. I haven't seen any evidence of that issue with the FZ30 at all, and I think the FZ50 has the issue nailed as well. I'd agree with Gene's surmises on IQ issues.

Oh, and though i don't have any quantitative reason for saying this, I'd bet that the OIS system of the FZ30/50 is good for at least another f-stop slower shutter speed for handheld shots over the FZ15.

If Harlan was here, he'd give you just the opposite arguments. Find him in Costa Rica someplace. ;)

[jcon]

Pave was dead on! If you dont plan on shooting in less than satisfactory lighting conditions, youll really enjoy the FZ50. It takes amazing outdoor pictures when the sun is out.

As Pave said, if you need the high ISO abilities, P&S isnt your best option.

If you are happy with what you are getting with the FZ15(happy with the noise control), I dont see a problem with you using the FZ50(Just make sure not to use the built in Noise Reduction, *YUCK*). Although, I do honestly believe the IQ is better in the FZ30.


:eek: Did I just recommend an FZ50 again!?!?! I swear I'm losing my mind!:eek: :p

[Honest Gaza]

So, can you have experience with these cameras (or the 20 and 50) give me some guidance as to the downsides of trading up? The FZ50 is about 5.3 ounces heavier and a bit bigger. What other things about it might be less appealing?

I loved my FZ20, and still do. When shooting in conditions that are ideal for this type camera....it is brilliant.

[MacBook]

Using the FZ30's manual zoom ring is like a dream compared to the electronic zoom of the FZ15. For one thing, the FZ30 recovers from sleep or power off in < 1 second, whereas the FZ15 took several seconds to recover, especially if you were shooting long zoom shots, which I am prone to do. One frustration completely gone.

Oh, and though i don't have any quantitative reason for saying this, I'd bet that the OIS system of the FZ30/50 is good for at least another f-stop slower shutter speed for handheld shots over the FZ15.


These reasons for upgrading are really strong. The manual zoom ring alone is just about worth the investment. I, too, enjoy this camera for long zoom shots. Given that, any improvement to the already-good OIS system is also very welcome.

The only concern left is quality in lower light situations. Outside shots pose no problems, of course. I see that several people have a DSLR as well and I suppose utilize those for lower light situations as well as having wider angle lenses for a variety of situations.

[MacBook]

I saw the Leica V-Lux 1 in a camera store this evening and really appreciated the manual zoom. I found it well made, but I can't imagine the Panasonic is not very similar. The viewfinder seemed not quite as bright as the FZ15. The right hand grip seemed bigger than the FZ15, I'm not sure that I prefer one or the other.

No one locally has the FZ50, the camera store only sells the Leica, so I couldn't compare, but I cannot find any technical reason to spend the extra $300, mostly emotional ones (Leica branding, claims of more moderate NR, etc.). The Leica was $50 less at the retail store than anywhere I can find online, so I would definitely buy it there IF I was buying the Leica.

One thing interesting about looking at these cameras is that while they will offer upgraded features and so forth, it reinforces what good cameras all these FZs have been.

[LoveLife]

I am a FZ15 owner who is generally happy with the camera. I am considering the FZ50 for a few reasons, including the lens zoom and other improvements about which I have read. However, I have fears after reading all the discussions about noise.

So, can you have experience with these cameras (or the 20 and 50) give me some guidance as to the downsides of trading up? The FZ50 is about 5.3 ounces heavier and a bit bigger. What other things about it might be less appealing?

IMO There is only one reason to go to another FZ camera IMAGE QUALITY nothing else matters. Image quality has been on a continuous downward slop after the FZ20.
You can master any camera faults but you cannot create quality tack sharp images with a pixel stuffed CDD and noise reduction image washing software. ALL you need for good quality pictures is 5MP.

Try this with an FZ30 or FZ50: Exposure 1/60-F2.8-ISO400-275mm FZ10.
http://lovelife.smugmug.com/photos/14003721-L-3.jpg

[dmonk]

Seriously, I think I am going to try shooting with noise reduction off on camera and see what ACDsee noise reduction does. The autoexposure does wonders.

[Mike63]

Let it snow...............

That's all I see. I see that it was iso 100 should not be to bad at that iso.

[jcon]

Seriously, I think I am going to try shooting with noise reduction off on camera and see what ACDsee noise reduction does. The autoexposure does wonders.

Thats a good idea, generally, in-camera NR isnt the best way to go(especially on the FZ50). I have ACDSEE Pro V.9 and for noise removal, I would suggest you look into trying out NeatImage, its better than ACDSEE and its also free.


And for what its worth, I agree 1 million% with LoveLife.

[LoveLife]

Seriously, I think I am going to try shooting with noise reduction off on camera and see what ACDsee noise reduction does. The autoexposure does wonders.
You can not turn NR off on the 30 and 50 it is mild on the 20 does that tell you something? The FZ10 does not have NR.

[dmonk]

I guess that's why I couldn't find it in the menu's..
I was actually about the find the manual.

So far I have been paranoid about shooting at anything over 100 though I did shoot some at 200.

I have been attempting to photograph nesting Eagles that are high in a pine tree at 100+ yards from road using a TCON-17 telec. I haven't been really sucessful yet, but I am going to try some shots at higher iso in order to to use smaller fstops and higher speeds.

back to the origional intent of the thread, I am having a blast with my FZ-50.
It is equal to or superior to my Canon DSLR with 75-300 lens and 2x teleconverter. I came to understand that without investing megabucks for the DSLR I wasn't getting any better pictures than I am with this camera.

[jcon]

....
So far I have been paranoid about shooting at anything over 100 though I did shoot some at 200.

....I am having a blast with my FZ-50.
It is equal to or superior to my Canon DSLR with 75-300 lens and 2x teleconverter. I came to understand that without investing megabucks for the DSLR I wasn't getting any better pictures than I am with this camera.

If I may.... that sounds a little strange. You first say youre afraid to shoot over ISO 100 with the FZ50, but yet it takes images just as good as your DSLR:confused: Im sure you know DSLRs are MADE for high ISO ability?

Now if your just taking basic pictures of birds and animals in the middle of a sun lit day, then yeah, maybe you would be happy with the FZ50, but I always find it amazing when someone says an all-in-one camera takes as good a picture as a DSLR(with a decent lens attached).

There is a reason they make all-in-one cameras... Convenience.

There is a reason they make DSLRs.... Quality.

[dmonk]

let me be more specific,
I use my camera on motorcycle trips.
I use my camera on birdwatching trips.
The FZ50 is much more convenient for those situations because I can put the camera in a tankbag and carry along with binoculars with ease.
I didn't intend to imply that the FZ50 is superior in every way to a DSLR.
If I wanted to invest in a quality 400+mm lense the DSLR would without a doubt deliver superior pictures.
I made a decision that a point and shoot camera with 12x zoom and manual focus made more sense for me mainly because of the weight / bulk of a DLSR camera and lens that would do what I wanted it to do.
I am not a professional. It is a hobby for me.
I am having fun with the camera.
Isn't that enough?

[jcon]

In the end, aslong as you are happy, thats all that matters. The only thing I wanted to clear up was the better picture statement, and now we have.

[genece]

To try and answer your questions the leica and the FZ50 are the exact same cameras except for the red dot.
I would not get the mack warrantry and the Panasonic warranty has been changed to 1yr parts and labor now.
And I have a vastly different take on the FZ30/50 they are wonderful cameras......well worth the upgrade from a a FZ10,15 or 20...
And if you consider price and convenience it does rivel a DSLR.....I understand the noise as well as anyone but if low light is not you major use its one fine camera.
If noise on the FZ15 does not bother you, the noise of the newer cameras will impress you.



I saw the Leica V-Lux 1 in a camera store this evening and really appreciated the manual zoom. I found it well made, but I can't imagine the Panasonic is not very similar. The viewfinder seemed not quite as bright as the FZ15. The right hand grip seemed bigger than the FZ15, I'm not sure that I prefer one or the other.

No one locally has the FZ50, the camera store only sells the Leica, so I couldn't compare, but I cannot find any technical reason to spend the extra $300, mostly emotional ones (Leica branding, claims of more moderate NR, etc.). The Leica was $50 less at the retail store than anywhere I can find online, so I would definitely buy it there IF I was buying the Leica.

One thing interesting about looking at these cameras is that while they will offer upgraded features and so forth, it reinforces what good cameras all these FZs have been.

[MacBook]

To try and answer your questions the leica and the FZ50 are the exact same cameras except for the red dot.
I would not get the mack warrantry and the Panasonic warranty has been changed to 1yr parts and labor now.
And I have a vastly different take on the FZ30/50 they are wonderful cameras......well worth the upgrade from a a FZ10,15 or 20...
And if you consider price and convenience it does rivel a DSLR.....I understand the noise as well as anyone but if low light is not you major use its one fine camera.
If noise on the FZ15 does not bother you, the noise of the newer cameras will impress you.

Gene,

I didn't know that Panasonic now has a one year warranty for the FZ50. The B&H site said 90 days and others did not indicate. I will confirm that when purchasing. I'm certainly leaning heavily towards the FZ50.

[jcon]

From BHPhoto.com....

For the FZ50....

90-Day Labor, 1-Year Parts U.S.A. Limited Warranty


And from Panasonics site.....

[John_Reed]

So it's a one-year parts warranty, EXCEPT for the CCD, good for only 6 months, EXCEPT for the battery, good for only 3 months. I'd call that a limited warranty?

I have to say that I've had multiple Panasonic cameras over the years since 2003, and I've never had a lick of trouble with any of them. If you're interested in having a longer warranty period, though, you might check into the Leica VLUX-1, which has a 3-year warranty, not to mention a 256MB SD card in the box, along with the famous Red Dot!

[genece]

I am pretty sure it was all over the other forum that is one year parts and labor.......but I never read that formally.

If I was wrong about the warranty I am sorry, it was stated so much at dpreview I thought it was true.

Edit
I got this at the other forum and I understand it may not be true
but some people said they read it on the Panasonic site.

Great News from Panasonic! The warranty on all Panasonic Digital cameras is now 1 year parts and labor. effective on November 6, 06

Warranty repairs on all DSC’s purchased within the past 12 months is 1 years parts and labor

That is a great step for Panasonic. Thanks, Panasonic!

[MacBook]

The Leica V-Lux 1 is listed at B&H with a two-year limited warranty. I cannot find the warranty listed on the Leica site.

The Panasonic warranty sure is stingy. The FZ-15 has been troublefree, and I know the quality is high, but I would expect one-year at least for a camera such as this one. Of course, the Panasonic costs just a little more than half as much as the Leica ($480 v. $850) so I guess one could always get a new one if ill fate befell it! :)

[genece]

I would call or Email Panasonic.....those other guys are sure the warranty has been extended......but as I say you can not prove it by me.