white eyes in pictures

[cathyleep]

i have a Sony DSC-H5 and recently got a Sony SLR a100k - the problem I've been having is when i take pictures in a gym or a large open area like that- (school program, cheerleading presentations) the kids have white eyes. To say they look scary is putting it mildly. I went to a camera store (Ritz/Wolf) and they told me they didn't have any suggestions other than trying to correct w/a computer program. Surely it must be something to do w/the flash reflecting off their eyes? I have found so much about red eye...what about this white eye. I have an important program coming up that will involve a gym area again and i don't know what to do. I'd prefer to use the auto DSC-H5 only because i have more experience with it.. I haven't learned enough about the settings on the SLR to know what i'm doing. Any suggestions?
h5

[mattdm]

Can you post an example?

[cdifoto]

It's probably Sony's way of trying to "eliminate" redeye...by making it white. Not a real solution but Sony thinks it works. I may be wrong though - post a sample like matt said.

[cathyleep]

Here is one of the many pictures of the kids with the white eyes. Basically any picture that the flash catches their eyes they turn white.. it only happens inside school gyms, that kind of environment. Not just in one camera but in the 3 Sony's i have. Do you think if i used the SLR and used a higher ISO w/no flash i would get any picture at all? These are little cheerleaders so they will be moving as well... I want to add the flash to the top so i can direct it up- maybe that would help? I took pictures in a bowling alley which turned out a little dark, which i expected with the lens and just using the reg flash. So i'm thinking i definitely need the add on flash for inside.

[cdifoto]

That's Sony's really crappy redeye "reduction" at work. See how there's still some red/pink around the white?

Redeye is caused when the flash is too close to the lens.. You need to get the flash off the camera somehow if you need flash. Whether you get/use an SLR or dSLR and an external flash or get one of those slaves and just turn down the power of the Sony's to a level just enough to trigger the slave or whatever....you need something you can bounce or at least get away from the lens.

[mattdm]

Can you post the EXIF data for this picture? That's definitely "red eye" light bouncing off the retina. I'm not quite sure why it's so white rather than red here, but yeah, clearly that's what's wrong.

I also notice an oddity in the levels of brightness in the image -- there's no black, only dark grey. It's a little clipped at the bright end, but not much. Basically, the camera isn't handling this very well at all for some reason.

Have you tried your idea of upping the ISO to the max and avoiding the flash? I don't know how well the S3 does with this. You probably could get away with that with a dSLR, especially shooting in RAW (although it's tedious if you take this sort of picture a lot to have to manually work with each one to make it look good).

An add on flash will help with the issue for two reasons. First, where the ceiling is low, you can direct it nearly straight up, which generally works very well. Second, even if you have to do the straight-on thing, the reflection in the eyes will point back at the flash itself, and if that's farther away from the lens, you won't see it as strongly in the recorded image.

[JLV]

Looking at the review on the Sony H5, there appears to be a way to shut the red eye off. You might try that and see what happens.

[mattdm]

Looking at the review on the Sony H5, there appears to be a way to shut the red eye off. You might try that and see what happens.

If you turn off the red-eye reduction, you'll probably get actual red eyes instead of the weird white.

[cathyleep]

Thanks for all your suggestions- unless the program is canceled on Sunday due to the icy weather i will give it a try - I'll let you know what happens.

[JLV]

If you turn off the red-eye reduction, you'll probably get actual red eyes instead of the weird white.

One can correct the Red Eye with post processing.

[mattdm]

One can correct the Red Eye with post processing.

One can disguise the red eye with post-processing, but red eye isn't a false camera artifact -- it's recording the real effect of the flash bouncing off of the eyes. So, actually correcting it is time consuming. If you're intending to make small prints, the typical desaturate/grey-out approach is fine, but if you want the actual appearance of non-flashed eyes....

[JLV]

My point was that if Sony’s red eye eliminator is making the eyes white, then don’t use it. Use PP.