Which memorycard will not be a bottleneck?

[Gadg]

Just got myself a Canon Powershot SD630. But I decided to check back here to see which memorycard I should buy, as different salespeople were giving me different stories on this matter.

Here is my issue:
I want the memorycard to NOT be the bottleneck when shooting video or shooting photos in continues-mode. In the review (http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/canon/powershot_sd630-review/) I read a movie takes 8 minutes to reach 1GB, which boils down to 2.13MB/sec of writing. The best shots the camera can take (superfine/large) takes 2.7MB per photo and is said (again in the review, but also by c|net (http://reviews.cnet.com/Canon_PowerShot_SD630/4505-6501_7-31740584.html)) to take about 2-2.1 shots per second. That results (taking the maximum for all) in 5.67MB of data to be written to the memory card.

In other words, I need a memorycard with a sustained write-speed of 5.67 megabyte per second (45 megabits per second). Rounded up for convenience, I need my card to be able to write at 40x (says wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secure_Digital)) or Class 6 (official speed indicator (http://www.sdcard.com/europe/TextPage.asp?Page=3)) for it to not be the bottleneck.

My questions are:

Is the analysis above sound ... or am I making any mistakes?
Is anybody aware of writing speed limitations in the camera itself?
Am I right in concluding that I need to buy Kingston Elite Pro (pegged at 50x (http://www.kingston.com/flash/pdf_files/mkms_874.pdf)), Lexar Platinum (40x (http://www.lexar.com/digfilm/compare_chart.html)), Sandisk Ultra II (min. 60x (http://www.sandisk.com/Products/Catalog(1051)-SanDisk_Ultra_II_SD_and_SDHC_Cards.aspx); the standard cards (http://www.sandisk.com/Products/Catalog(1052)-SanDisk_Standard_SD_and_SDHC.aspx) claim a high transfer rate, but I can't find any numbers) or Panasonic cards with the golden label (different speeds (http://www2.panasonic.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/vModelList?storeId=15001&catalogId=13401&catGroupId=25163&orderBy=recommended&surfCategory=SD%20Memory%20Cards&cacheProgram=11002&cachePartner=7000000000000005702))
Am I being an idiot in wanting these high data rates, as I'm only a 'point-and-shoot' type casual photographer?

[truflip]

that camera has the DIGICII processor which will live happy with a 60x card. 40x is the bare minimum if you want to get the best out of it.. 60x is the maximum without going overboard and wasting money...

I recommend the Sandisk Ultra II 2GB card (60x or 10/9mb read/write)
only time you will need over 60x is if you want the fastest possible upload speed to PC hope this helps :)

[Gadg]

The reading is not my main concern. It's about the writing. And while I agree 40x is the bare minimum and it might not be the best idea to just comply with the bare minimum, I'd think a card that promises to sustain a write-speed of 50x should suffice just fine. Would you agree?

I ask this, because I've seen countless Kingston cards (50x) around today, but never noticed the Sandisk cards. I'm sure they're there ... but 'just in case' ...

[Tsanford]

I have a Scandisk 1.0gb 60x card in my A620 and I am not very happy with it. For my first 50 shots or so, it works perfectly, but then after that the speed of continuous shots slows way down and lagggggs. Also when it is full, the speed of viewing the images in playback mode sucks and takes over a second to see each one. When there are under 50 shots, it runs perfectly. I really want a 150x or 160x card. I think you should get a 150x or 160x card too.

I would recommend any of these: Link one (http://www.sandisk.com/Products/Catalog(1049)-SanDisk_Extreme_III_SD_Cards.aspx) & Link two (http://www.sandisk.com/Products/Catalog(1051)-SanDisk_Ultra_II_SD_and_SDHC_Cards.aspx)

[cristiantrifan]

My PS A620 works better then I expected with TwinMOS 1GB SD 150x (http://www.twinmos.com/flash/flash_p_sd_150x.htm), Samsung memory chips ;) .

[truflip]

samsung is the most popular, common, best and reliable memory/chip/IC manufacturer.. i wouldnt doubt it if sandisk were using the same chips as well :)

go samsung! :D

[BowerR64]

I think 2-2.1 shots per-second means with the flash off. The flash charge is whats slow.

Do they mean the speed on the cards is 50X or its a 50X burst? meaning it will reach 50X speeds but not consistantly run at 50X.

Isnt there a way we can check the data on the memory cards? Like use a program like sissoft sandra 2006 and it checks the type of memory, the max read and write speed and the chip mfgr?

There are programs that tell all kinds of hidden details about the stuff on the computer.

[BowerR64]

Hey that program does have a memory test! the one i have is called sandra 2004 but i think the newer versions maybe better and tell more data. Here is the benchmark of my 256 meg sandisk card. I have no idea the speed of it but this is what it tests

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y191/BowerR64/Camera/256sdmemory.jpg

THe benchmark on the left is just a removable drive benchmark like its a removable hard drive or somthing. That was a 64 meg SD card

It kinda looks like the card is limited to the USB port with seems to show them both at 3megs a second?

[David Metsky]

I have the SD300 which has the same video mode as the SD630. The basic Sandisk card (not Ultra-II) works just fine at any video setting or burst mode (2.6 fps, 4 MP, SuperFine). The write speed of the camera just isn't that fast, or the Sandisk cards preform higher than they are rated.

-dave-

[Gadg]

Unlike what you might think, it's not the video mode but the continuous-shooting mode that is the bandwidth guzzler. And the images your camera produces are smaller in size than the ones my camera produces. Your finding does conform what all the manufacterers are saying, to use 'normal speed card' for cameras under 5mpx. So your comment does unfortunately not answer my question, although I appreciate your effort in trying to help out ofcourse.

[Gadg]

@Bower64:
Researching this a bit more before breakfast this morning (I was out late, ok? :D ) it seems the advertised is a sustained write speed. Source for this is however not the Kingston website, but countless results found on Google - I know, not the most reliable of sources but one has got to go on something.

Sandisk does claim a MINIMUM sustained write speed of 66x for their cards.

So I'm off to breakfast. And this afternoon will try to find a Sandisk or Kingston card for a good price.

[ocspray]

We're discussing Canon memory over here, too. (http://www.dcresource.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24374)

Try emailing or calling Canon Tech Support (http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ContactCanonAct) if you want answers specific to your camera, such as maximum addressable memory, maximum video file size, and recommended memory speed. Their response was quick, and with regard to my SD800 IS, the tech said that as long as the memory was SDHC (Secure Digital, High Capacity) compliant, the camera would recognize and work fine with it. For your SD630, you may not need SDHC memory, but it'd be a good idea to look for that spec while shopping. While I understand the safety-in-numbers approach to memory, keep your camera's video capabilities in mind while shopping, because it will eat up alot of space. Newegg has good selection and prices. (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.asp?Page=1&Category=7&Nty=1&N=2010070068+1053107930&Submit=ENE&SubCategory=68)

[truflip]

SDHC is the newer tech of SD type cards.. it basically enables SD cards to go past 2GB.. thats all.. its not like it makes anything better and faster.. infact most SDHC cards are 4GB writing at 2mb/s :p

like I said.. SD630 uses DIGIC II processors.. and these processors are not able to take advantage of anything more than 10mb/sec write at max whether its continouos shooting or long videos, sooo... 50-60x is all you will need with this 6mp camera..

I just did a test on my Sandisk Ultra II 2GB rated at 60x.. took 238 shots from 2h 21m 14s am to 2h 23m 51s am (238shots/158seconds).. thats 1.51 frames per second... just to let u know, it did not hiccup once.. steady from 0 to 238 ;)

so tried high speed mode.. 2:32.00-2:32.53, thats 53 seconds and i took 121shots.. thats 2.28 pictures per second.. and again, this all happened with the card staying cool and not hiccuping one even for a split second..

i just took 359 shots in a few minutes.. lol first time i did this.. my counter which is gonna throw me off when i track my pictures (i track them by the numbers in IMG_xxxx :p) so i hope this helps answer your questions and concerns about 60x cards.. if u look at Jeff's reviews on Canons with DIGIC II.. max you will get is 2 fps anyway.. so let me know if u need anything else ;)

[ocspray]

Thanks! You actually put some real media in a real camera and really stressed it, with nary a problem. That kind of info means more than anything else to me. Hopefully, my Transcend memory will live up to its specs and do the same.

[Gadg]

@Truflip:
Dude, thanks so much for doing that! It makes it all the more likely that I will be getting the Sandisk card IF I can find it at Pantip (Bangkok) today. I saw Kingston all over, which is why I've been so focussed on the results with that card. But the fact that this has actually been 'real life tested' means a lot. Thanks again!

Oh, let's nitpick ... what is the average filesize? :-) Because some pictures take a whole lot more storage space ... if you were taking shots of a white wall, the images might have been fairly small.

[truflip]

Thanks! You actually put some real media in a real camera and really stressed it, with nary a problem. That kind of info means more than anything else to me. Hopefully, my Transcend memory will live up to its specs and do the same.
my pleasure! i always wanted to run this test anyway but never found a good reason to till now :) i hear of people saying their card starts to choke after 50 continuous shots.. so i got curious.. its a win for u n win for me ;)


@Truflip:
Dude, thanks so much for doing that! It makes it all the more likely that I will be getting the Sandisk card IF I can find it at Pantip (Bangkok) today. I saw Kingston all over, which is why I've been so focussed on the results with that card. But the fact that this has actually been 'real life tested' means a lot. Thanks again!

Oh, let's nitpick ... what is the average filesize? :-) Because some pictures take a whole lot more storage space ... if you were taking shots of a white wall, the images might have been fairly small.
hmm.. Bangkok eh.. i thought you were somewhere in America.. sorry! I read a lot about the Kingston and its not really a favourite in the digital camera world.. Sandisk Ultra and Extreme series are the king here ;) soo try to find those if you can theyre well worth the extra money.. unless its twice as much as the kingstons :p

the average file size for all 300+ shots are 3.40mb. i was just shooting at my LCD monitor.. files get smaller when your shooting outdoors in the daytime but i doubt it will get any faster..

[Gadg]

hmm.. Bangkok eh.. i thought you were somewhere in America.. sorry! Born and raised in Amsterdam (Netherlands), but live in Asia now :-)


the average file size for all 300+ shots are 3.40mb. i was just shooting at my LCD monitor.. files get smaller when your shooting outdoors in the daytime but i doubt it will get any faster..makes it all the more impressive. so off I go, in search of a sandisk card!

[truflip]

ahh ic! .. visit philippines sometimes ;) not that far to the east hehehe
take care and happy memory card hunting! :D

[Gadg]

I looked around for about an hour and was able to find a 1GB version, but a 2GB version was nowhere to be found. Even if I had found it, believe it or not, it would have been more than double the price of a Kingston Elite Pro card. So I decided to go for that one instead, it's advertised as having a 50x write-speed.

Got a 2GB card for just under US$45 ... not a bad deal I would think.

I tried continuous-shot in the store and it didn't seem to hick up for about 300 images. On-camera I can't read out the seconds of the datestamp when the image was taken, so I can't quite make out how fast the card is just yet. I'll try to get you guys those results in a while.

[XaiLo]

Thanks! You actually put some real media in a real camera and really stressed it, with nary a problem. That kind of info means more than anything else to me. Hopefully, my Transcend memory will live up to its specs and do the same.

I use a 2GB 150x Transcend no issues...;)

[David Metsky]

I use a 2GB 150x Transcend no issues...;)
At the prices now, I bought two.

The maximum image size I've seen from the SD300 is 2.2M and it takes burst mode at 2.6 fps, which means 5.72M/sec, or a slightly higher rate than the SD630. In reality, image size isn't usually that large when in burst mode. I just took 50 shots in burst and the average image size was about 1.6M.

I've never had a problem shooting in burst mode with either of my regular Sandisk cards, and I shoot in burst mode when skiing a lot. I'd be surprised if you ran into a bottleneck with the SD630 with that card. Having said that, with the price of cards like the Transcend 150x so low there's no reason not to buy one of the high speed card. I just don't think you'll notice anything different in real world shooting.

-dave-

[truflip]

Got a 2GB card for just under US$45 ... not a bad deal I would think.
is that the white ones? i think those are seksi lol
hey man for $45 USD thats a damn good deal.. Canadian electronics pricing stinks :(

I use a 2GB 150x Transcend no issues...;)
how much do those cost in USD? i found one on ebay for $58 shipped (+tax)
trying to see if i can get it cheaper..
theres a patriot brand, 133x for $58 shipped with tax.. hmm

At the prices now, I bought two.

The maximum image size I've seen from the SD300 is 2.2M and it takes burst mode at 2.6 fps, which means 5.72M/sec, or a slightly higher rate than the SD630. In reality, image size isn't usually that large when in burst mode. I just took 50 shots in burst and the average image size was about 1.6M.

I've never had a problem shooting in burst mode with either of my regular Sandisk cards, and I shoot in burst mode when skiing a lot. I'd be surprised if you ran into a bottleneck with the SD630 with that card. Having said that, with the price of cards like the Transcend 150x so low there's no reason not to buy one of the high speed card. I just don't think you'll notice anything different in real world shooting.

-dave-
your camera has lower MP.. file size will be smaller, maybe thats why regular sandisks work like a charm.. ?? hmm not sure but anyway, how much did u get those transcends for?

btw whats up with the cheesy FLASHY rainbow colours on these cards? :confused: :confused:

[Gadg]

Just did the same test done with the Sandisk card last night by Truflip. Here is what I found ...

Over a period of 398 seconds, I shot 714 photos totalling 1.9GB in size, which means I was doing:


1.8 frames per second
2.7 megabyte per frame
4.9 megabytes per second (33x)


Which could mean the card is not living up to it's promises. To avoid jumping to conclusions, I am open to suggestions to speed up the shooting by tweaking the camera settings. Here is what my current settings are ...


Manual mode (otherwise I can't enable continuous shot)
Large image (2816x2112)
Superfine
AiAF = OFF
AF-assist Beam = OFF
Digital Zoom = OFF
Review = OFF
Grid Lines = OFF
Long Shutter = OFF
Mute = ON
Auto Rotate = ON


I have the feeling the performance could be u higher, since the green light was flashing on and off with every shot. I don't know what that light means (writing, or ready for the next or whatever) ...

Suggestions?

[truflip]

was this in High speed mode? check the settings..
press menu, i think its 3-4 lines down its the "High Speed Continuous" mode.. set that to on and try again, its much faster..

if u have that on and youre only getting 1.8fps.. then im not sure.. try video mode and you can get up to 60fps ;) jk jk

is this the elite pro by kingston?

[Gadg]

I guess you have different software ... I can't find anything about high speed continuous ...

[David Metsky]

your camera has lower MP.. file size will be smaller, maybe thats why regular sandisks work like a charm.. ?? hmm not sure but anyway, how much did u get those transcends for?
But my camera shoots at a higher frame rate (2.6fps vs 2.0fps), meaning that it can create a larger data stream than your SD630 if I read the numbers correctly. The image size and the fps both go into creating the data stream. Don't get hung up on just one factor. Theoreticaly, the SD300 puts a greater demand on memory cards than the SD630. For the SD series, as the image size goes up the fps goes down, I think they all end up producing roughly the same data stream in burst mode.

I needed larger memory cards for a long backpacking trip in September. I found them at newegg.com for $33. I didn't need the 150x but they were cheaper then the slower cards and they download quicker from my card reader. At these prices, I don't see any reason to buy a basic speed card today. But I don't think that it would be required to support the cameras burst mode.

-dave-

[truflip]

ahh $33... wow.. minimum i must pay for a 2GB @ 133x is $48.99 and thats on sale.. i think this is good price considering im in Canada.. gonna pick one up ASAP =)

[XaiLo]

43.99 @ newegg.com truflip... makes me want to cry compared to what I had to pay for it eight months ago.