Which ultra compact? Indoors flash-free shots of baby etc.

[hbkscotia]

Budget
Q.* What budget have you allocated for buying this camera? Please be as specific as possible.
A. US$400 at the most. Preferably a bit cheaper. (though buying in Britain, equivalent c.£215)

Size
Q.* What size camera are you looking for? Or does size not matter at all to you?
A. Ultra-compact. Most important feature. (I have a Fuji s5500 - too bulky to carry around.)

Features
Q. How many megapixels will suffice for you?
A. 6MP (or whatever will allow me to print a clear/sharp 8.5" x 11" photo)

Q. * What optical zoom will you need? (None, Standard = 3x-4x, Ultrazoom = 10x-12x, Other - Specify)
A. Standard

Q.* How important is “image quality” to you? (Rate using a scale of 1-10)
A. 8. Does "image quality" mean something other than how good the photo looks? Willing to pay a little bit more for clear, sharp, beautiful photos.

Q. Do you care for manual controls?
A. Not important to me. (Though it would be nice to get that blurred background effect!)

General Usage
Q.* What will you generally use the camera for?
A. Taking photos of my 14 month old daughter.

Would like to take photos inside that don't use flash. My flash photos often have red eye, and skin-tone isn't so attractive. Photos without a flash indoors are often blurred, or too dull/dark. I bought a tripod but it's too bulky/I'm too lazy to cart it around with me.

(I've looked at image stabilisation cameras like the Panasonic Lumix DMC FX 9EB and Canon IXUS 800 IS (not sure if this is available in the USA - I live in Scotland) but reading this website I wonder if something like the Fuji F30 would be better at getting rid of the blur when taking photos of my little girl?)

I'd like to take the camera with me everywhere, snapping the occasional macro shot of a flower etc.


Q.* Will you be making big prints of your photos or not?
A. No bigger than 12" x 12"

Q. Will you be shooting a lot of indoor photos or low light photos?
A. Yes. (More photos inside my house than photos in nightclubs though!)

Q. Will you be shooting sports and/or action photos?
A. Not often.

Miscellaneous

Q. Are there particular brands you like or hate?
A. No. I have a Fuji (s5500) and wonder if it's a "serious" camera brand, but happy to go with whatever's highly recommended.

Q. Are there particular models you already have in mind?
A. Panasonic Lumix DMC FX 9EB; Canon IXUS 800 IS (not sure if this is available in the USA.); Fuji F30.

Q. (If applicable) Do you need any of the following special features? (Wide Angle, Image Stabilization, Weatherproof, Hotshoe, Rotating LCD)
Image Stabilisation or something equivalent to let me take photos indoors of my daughter without using the flash.


THANKS FOR YOUR HELP. :)

[hbkscotia]

I'll be shooting in auto mode most of the time - not sure if that makes a difference in choosing the best ultra compact? :confused:

[coldrain]

The FX9 should be avoided since it is one of the famous Panasonic noise monsters, not a thing to get when you want indoors non-flash photos.

If you don't need it to be ultra compact, but just compact, consider the Fuji F30.
If you need it to be ultra compact, consider the Fuji Z2/Z3, the Canon SD700 IS(same as the Ixus 800 IS), and Sony W series like the Sony W50.

[MindBender]

I think the Fuji F20 or Fuji F30 fits the most requirements that you set in the thread. The F30 pretty small, I haven't had any problem carrying it around and neither has my girlfriend. It's small enough to be comfortably used one handed in my opinion. The biggest feature that it will give you over any other point and shoot camera is the low light photos without flash. So far I haven't had any problem taking photos indoors at night without any flash. It also has some nice flash features that will help to eliminate blown out skin tones due to firing a flash at close range in dark conditions.

There is also a new Pentax Optimo coming out soon that is supposed to have a higher ISO setting for indoor shots, but it's not as good as the Fuji ones. The body size looks about the same as the F30 from what I've seen.

Coldrain also mentioned the Fuji Z-series camera... which are kind of the little brother to the F30/F20 cameras. They have a high ISO, although not as high and are about 2/3 the size of the F30. 5mp as opposed to 6.3mp sensor also. If you really need something smaller this might be a good way to go. The price is about the same as the F30/F20.

[hbkscotia]

Thanks both for the replies. :)

[atoprak]

I think you should also look at Olympus mju800 as well... compact and powerfull...

[pjd]

Hi

I was going to attach a jpeg as an example photo but it way exceeds the forum's limits- how can I compress it sufficiently to attach it.

Ta

[sjseto]

Hi

I was going to attach a jpeg as an example photo but it way exceeds the forum's limits- how can I compress it sufficiently to attach it.

Ta

You need a photo editing program to resize the photo. Then in your "save as" options, choose a higher compression or lower quality setting to reduce the file size even further.

Hbkscotia, I agree with the others that the F30 would be the best choice for you. The other cameras you mentioned are very good and image stabilization is handy in some situations, but not so much when you're trying to photograph a moving subject in less than ideal lighting without using a flash. You need a camera that is capable of good quality high ISO photos, and that's what the F30 will give you. The only thing I would recommend when using the camera is that you eventually try to wean yourself off of using it in full auto mode, as you become more familiar with it. The F30 is good in auto, but it's at its best when you choose the settings yourself.

My next choice would be the SD700 IS, because it does have ISO 800. It's a pretty grainy ISO 800 but if you use noise reduction software to clean it up, you'll probably get a decent image.

Stephanie

[pjd]

hbkscotia

Seems like you're in the UK- I took this photo at 2142 last evening in Belfast (presumably a little west of you and hence still ever so slightly brighter than where you are but not much), using a Fuji F30. There is no flash, just the predetermined night scene, a 1 second exposure and a suppressed flash. The ISO was ISO3200.

I'm no expert at all but I think this has come out extremely well. For night/ low light/ flashless you might struggle to outperform this camera. FYI, the slightly orangey effect at either side is actuall from street lamps behind the tree.

p.s. hope the attachment works ok....

p.p.s thanks for the compression advice- came out somewhat smaller than I'd hoped though!

[BonjiB]

I haven't had any experience with the fuji's but that canon sd 700 IS is a great buy. It's iso 400 is completely usable and 800 ain't too shabby either. You'll need something that performs well at at least iso 400 to grab your indoor shots that you're after and image stabilization doesn't hurt either. Plus it's super cute and tiny. That's my vote. Good luck.

EDIT: after reviewing several reviews of the fuji f30 and viewing multiple sample shots at all ISO's (especially iso 800) i have come to second the recomendation of the fuji f30. The higher iso settings are AMAZING for a point and shoot and a compact one at that. The iso 800 shot of the baby below at dpreview blew me away. I want one of these for myself now. LOL. I've never seen a point and shoot with not only a useable iso 800 but a GOOD iso 800. Bravo to fuji!

http://img2.dpreview.com/gallery/fujifinepixf30_samples/originals/dscf0470.jpg (full resolution picture = big size)

[hbkscotia]

Thanks for the extra input. :)

Before I commit to the Fuji F30, are the photos and colours sharp and vibrant when using it for non low-light situations e.g. outdoors photos?

I've read it's the best low-light camera but I'd like it to be as good as the Canon 700/800 IS for other shots too.

Thanks for helping me spend my hard-earned cash wisely. :D

[dotbalm]

I have the Fuji F30 and Sony DSC-P150. I also have the Canon A80 and have used the S500.

I have a 2+ yr old. My comments will mostly be in the context of infant/toddler shots.

Quick and dirty:


- see reviews of F30, Sony DSC-P150/P200, here and dpreview
* http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/sony/dsc_p150-review/index.shtml
* http://dcresource.com/reviews/fuji/finepix_f30-review/index.shtml
* http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/fujifilmf30/
* http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/sonydscp200/
- thread FYI - http://www.dcresource.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23026
- The F30 has good low light ability but not as good as I thought, I still use flash with ISO 400
- the F30 has a great natural & flash mode where it takes two shots, one w/ and one w/o flash. Works well outdoors to compare ambient to fill flash results.
- the Sonys deliver no red-eye 95% of the time while flash is on and red-eye reduction is off, because the flash is far enough from the lens
- the Sonys throttle flash down well, no wash out
- Sony ISO clean up to 200
- Fuji ISO clean up to 400 and 800 ok
- the Sonys are discont'd but can be found online and deserve serious consideration if you have infants/toddlers
- wasn't sure if you wanted a no-flash solution or if you didn't want flash if it meant washed out images (not adequate throttling down) or if it was the only way to achieve high enough shutter speed for sharp images, but then produced red-eye.
- this site does a great service (imho): a red-eye test for compacts, where flash and red-eye are enabled. I can knock out most if not all compacts (including Canons), on this test alone b/c they still produce red-eye with red-eye reduction enabled. For infants/toddlers, their fleeting expression is often ruined by the red-eye strobe, so lack of red-eye "must" be achieved without using red-eye reduction, in other words, flash-only (DSC-P150/200), or no flash at all (F30). Consider the tests at the links above. BTW, the issue isn't confined to Canon, it's a design/ergonomics issue for compacts, but there is a low tech solultion (Sony) and a high tech solution (F30).
- image stabilization is good for hand shake to help prevent blur or to gain a stop or two, but for a toddler, a bigger concern is that she as the subject is moving so fast that you need the speed that clean high ISOs (or flash) can afford. Once your girl plays sports, the IS will help when you use telephoto, but you will likely have another camera by then, so I think IS is probably a bonus; more important is proper indoor flash performance (no wash out, no red-eye) or clean enough high ISOs to preclude flash for those shots.
- if you're going to do landsapes then IS becomes a bigger benefit.
- the Sony takes excellent landscape shots; haven't tried w/ Fuji yet.

Ever since I replaced my Canon A80 with the Sony DSC-P150 when my son turned 6 mo old (or so), I've been ecstatic about indoor flash shots of my son ever since with the Sony. No postprocessing! Remember, though, clean only up to ISO 200.

I'm still learning the F30 and don't care for its out of camera sharpness, it has caused me to spend more time post processing than I'd like. It's a new skill to develop, but I'd prefer not to do it with a point and shoot in all honesty.

[Jack_M]

hbkscotia

Seems like you're in the UK- I took this photo at 2142 last evening in Belfast (presumably a little west of you and hence still ever so slightly brighter than where you are but not much), using a Fuji F30. There is no flash, just the predetermined night scene, a 1 second exposure and a suppressed flash. The ISO was ISO3200.

I'm no expert at all but I think this has come out extremely well. For night/ low light/ flashless you might struggle to outperform this camera. FYI, the slightly orangey effect at either side is actuall from street lamps behind the tree.

p.s. hope the attachment works ok....

p.p.s thanks for the compression advice- came out somewhat smaller than I'd hoped though!


That looks pretty light to me...did you really need ISO3200 for that?