In a quarry...

[marcin]

I am leaving for Las Veegas in a week and a half and would love to buy the FZ50 but am now debating whether it would be wise to wait and pay so much...
I am looking for a good camera. I do not take many night shots, mostly day - but having said that, I want to make sure that low light pictures aren't duds either.

I know that the FZ30 is plagued by bad bad noise at anything over 100ISO but is the 10mp vs 8mp worth waiting for and paying $200 more?

For the $200 I could get a telephoto lens and a wide lens.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Also, I was looking at the Rebel XT but am just not sure about the whole slr thing. Is it really much better? Also would I have to get Canon's lenses or would other companies work?

Thanks
Reply With Quote

[genece]

Now as much as I like the FZ30 ....you seem more concerned with low light and noise than with the zoom and IS....If you feel the zoom is not extremely important to you then there are better choices but if the zoom and IS is important the FZ30 is the best ultrazoom available.....and the FZ50 may or may not be worth more ...we will have to wait and see.

If noise and low light ability is important to you look at the Fuji F30.

If the IS is important there are other Panasonics that may suit your needs.
The TZ1 may be for you.....but if you want an ultrazoom the FZ30 is great....
Taking photos on the strip at night is not really low light. And the FZ30 works great with an external Flash

You can use 3rd party lenses with any DSLR they just must be the correct mount for the camera you have......The Nikon D50 is a great entry level DSLR.....as is the XT but more expensive. And they both have great lens choices.
Also the new sony and Pentax,have IS and the pentax is priced right.

[marcin]

hello...
thank you for the response. actually the original reason i looked into the lumix was because of the ultrazoom. i love photographing wildlife and distant objects. i would do much more of that than low light shots.

i found this deal on ebay for a new lumix (silver not black) for $635 shipped with all the goodies. Do you think it's a good deal?

http://cgi.ebay.com/Panasonic-Lumix-DMC-FZ30S-Camera-DMC-FZ30-2LENS-1GB-KIT_W0QQitemZ140015542281QQihZ004QQcategoryZ107904 QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[dev]

I was expecting pictures of rocks...

[BonjiB]

For what it is the fz series are EXCELLENT ultrazooms. Now... that being said, nothing beats an SLR (a Canon slr in my opinion) as far as low light, smooth images, noise free pictures and lens options. Granted, you'll be paying more in the long run because to cover the same range of focal distances that the fz30 covers you'll require 2 maybe 3 slr lenses to get the job done RIGHT. Now the whole IS thing isn't as required with slr's as it is in a point and shoot. I say this because with my canon 20d (and the Rebel XT is in the same ballpark) i can bump iso up to 800 and still get far smoother results than the fz30 can deliver even at iso 200 (i own both cameras.) Thus i'm effectively shooting 2 or 3 stops faster by bumping iso versus using image stabilization AND getting better results. So to me IS on an slr isn't neccesary for what i do.

Now... about third party lenses... they work great. I'm saving up for tamron's 17-50 f/2.8 right now. It's a 450 dollar lens but it's up to par (from what i've read and test shot) with Canon's similar L series lens that costs over twice as much. They do have their downsides but for the amount of money you spend they're often worth it. Such as most all third party lenses do not communicate distance information for ettl-II flash metering. I'm ok with that though cuz the metering works just fine, just no distance information factored in. The kit lenses that come with most dslr's are bargains and are decent lenses (some would argue, but then again some shoot weddings and require the absolute best.) A standard kit lens for the rebel xt is the 17-55 f/3.5-5.6 (which is a 3.2x wideangle-normal lens in point and shoot speak.) Keep in mind the X factor in a lens refers to the big number divided by the small number x numbers don't take into account the RANGE of focal lengths covered. A 100-300 is 3x just like a 10-30 is 3x but they cover VERY different focal distances. This kit lens is a little slow in the respect that the minimum f number isn't as low as i'd like to see it which is why i steer clear of the kit lens and am saving for that tamron i mentioned earlier however i'm wanting to eventually get into professional photography. For day to day snapshots the lens i use is a 28-105 f/3.5-4.5 which works just fine for what i use it for in my day to day snapshooting.

Ok enough ranting... bottom line... it sounds to me like what you want is a dslr. I have an fz30 and it's a FANTASTIC camera. But it has it's limitations. Outside during the day, it's razor sharp and crystal clear and it holds it own and has a damn fine 12x zoom (35-420) to make composing shots really nice and easy. However, inside... you HAVE to have a flash, absolutely HAVE to have a flash unless you want you pictures looking like you dragged em through sand by bumping iso. Smaller sensor camera's just can't bump iso like a dslr's sensor can (it has to do with the physical size of the sensor and the amount of little light collecting do dads pasted onto that sensor.) THe fz30 produces very nice and usable images into iso 200 with minimal clean up but iso 400 is really for all intents and purposes unusable for anything larger than a 4x6 print and even then you have to clean it up to make the noise non distracting. Iso 200 is for like... outside during an overcast day. It's not a speed recomended for indoor photography which is where i found the fz30 to be sadly lacking. I take it along with me but i can't say that i prefer it over my 20d in MOST situations. The 20d cost me more than i wanted to spend but the results are fantastic and well worth the money paid. I figure from now on i won't settle. I'll get my eye set on what i know i need and will be happy with and just save up until i can afford it. That's my advice to you. Assess what you'll use the camera for and purchase accordingly. I don't mean to bang on the fz30 cuz i really do love the camera and the whole camera line but after i've gotten the dslr bug and have been shooting with one i can honestly say there really is no comparison.

Good luck!

[genece]

That is too much for the FZ30 you will be able to get the FZ50 for that price in a month or so.
And those extras are junk....you need very few extras to start a large card and perhaps a filter and your in business

try here
http://www2.butterflyphoto.com/shop/product.aspx?ref=dealtime&sku=DMCFZ30S

I am not touching the dslr claims...if it were only that simple no one would buy a consumer camera.

[BonjiB]

I am not touching the dslr claims...if it were only that simple no one would buy a consumer camera.

Gene, I almost feel like a backstabber cuz i love my fz30 so much. But although it is a more compicated venue to learn, i feel it is one that anyone who is really "serious" about photography should learn. And i put serious in quotes because i feel that some of us who wish to go (or at least desire to take pictures like) the professional route require a dslr to really make photography a worthwhile experience. Not to knock the fz30; it's definately the best ultrazoom on the market to date. Don't get me wrong there, i love it. Oh well, i guess different people require different things from their cameras.

[genece]

Oh do not get me wrong the DSLRs will take better photos when used with better glass.....and better glass is the expensive part.....I really like my D50 but someone asked me a couple days ago that if I could only have one camera and one lens what would it be......I thought and considered ,and for my type of photos the FZ30 is the hands down choice.

Raise the lens choices and if money and convenience was no concern.....

The huge thing to achieve the 400mm at a price thats in the range of my pockets, I choose the Sigma 80 to 400OS ($1000.00) and I need the OS ....I tried with it turned off and the results are terrible.

I also was on boats with 2 people with a 75 to 300 canon lens with no IS and their photos also left a lot to be desired....They both said they are getting a stabilized lens, it is not as simple as turning up the ISO.
If it were, no one would lay out the money for the stabilized ones.

I also have the 18 to 200 VR lens (which is the reason I chose Nikon) the photos I get from it are very impressive to me...but 200mm is not enough for me when searching out wildlife.

And I also would like a 400 F2.8 prime but its not in my price range at all

And if I had a Canon the 500 IS lens would have me wishing I was richer.

[jcon]

I agree that $600 for that crappy kit is a waste. The Nikon D50 body is going for around $500. I owned a Pana FZ20 and I loved it, but needed low light capabilities, so I went for the D50 and dont regret one minute of it! I truly think you are headed in the same direction. I think you should look at as many sample photos as possible and compare before you lay down your hard earned money only to regret your purchase down the road. You said yourself, the FZ30 is a very very noisy camera. However, you think the FZ50 will be any better? NO!! Since the excellent FZ20, the FZ series has gone downhill and its getting worse!




I am not touching the dslr claims...if it were only that simple no one would buy a consumer camera.

The reason people buy consumer and long zoom cameras are for the ease of use, the ability to have a quick easy long zoom, the "all in one" camera! Not to mention, all that is packaged together at a fairly cheap price. I would venture a guess that the people that buy these cameras are fairly new to photography and after getting their feet wet, they look to get into DSLR down the road. There is a reason DSLR is more expensive, the quality is better! Let me finish here by saying, I LOVED the FZ20 and I will probably buy one to keep as a backup and to let family use.

[marcin]

I agree that $600 for that crappy kit is a waste.

I priced out the camera and everything that comes with it at several stores including butterfly and all the well known ones and if I was going to get everything seperately, WITH FREE shipping, I am hovering somewhere around $900... so I am happy with the purchase.

I looked at many many sample photos, and do like the FZ30. I was always dissapointed with my old digital cameras inadequate zoom, so the 19.1x @3mp with an additional 2x lens attachment should be fine :D

I would like to go with the Rebel XT or other dSLR but have not enough money to purchase all the lenses I would truly need, now or later.

Thanks for the input guys.

[MikeCamp]

One point I'll make about dslr camera's is unless you are a professional making money with your camera it's pointless to own a dslr in my opinion. There is more bang for your buck available than the current dslr cameras offer. There is also a lot you can learn using a FZ series camera as well. I've personally taken pictures with my FZ I'd put up against dslr camera shots.

[Mike63]

I just wish the manufacturers would make digital camera bodies that would accept all the manual style lens that are in existance everywhere. While I appreciate all the bells and whistles that auto cameras have I am perfectly capable of taking good photo's with a manual camera. It would be sweet to use all my old gear that is taking up closet space.