Canon Rebel XT 350D - Grip

[krzkrzkrz]

Hello,

I have been hearing about the hand grip quality on the Canon Rebel XT 350D. I am new to DSLR's and just about two weeks ago I got the opportunity to hold the Rebel XT.

Users have been expressing the poor quality of the hand grip on the Rebel XT. Im starting to fall under the impression that this camera is meant for photographers with small hands. I dont mean to sound prejudice in any way. Please correct me if I am wrong.

I have quite big hands, and to me the grip was 'ok'. Evidently, I wasnt in the shop to hold it for an hour or so and due to my lack of experience with DSLR's , I cannot give an expert judgement on the quality of the hand grip.

Therefore, this is why I seek your attention and feedback. Bottom-line; Is the hand-grip in the Rebel XT really that bad?

[coldrain]

Japanese people are small compared to for instance Europeans. All the blah blah about hand grips is often very silly, since the grips are designed by Japanese, and they are not designed for big or small hands.
The more "ergonomic" the grips are shaped, the more irritating I find them, they are clearly maybe ergonomic to the designers hand, but not to mine!

Of the DSLRs I have held, I find the 350D/XT one of the most comfortable, for the simple fact that it does offer good grip, without trying to force my hand into whatever the designer had in mind. Also the 20D is ok in my hand, but a little bit less since it allows me less freedom to have my hand as my hand likes to be. The Olympus E-500 also feels good in my hand, the Nikon D70s not at all, and the D50 and Pentax *istDL both do not feel very good either.

It is very personal, and so you have to judge it for yourself. I personally can not stand the more (actually less) ergonomically shaped ones due to that I simply do not have the same hands as the designer. I have quite big hands with long fingers. It is BS when people say the 350D/XT is for small hands.

[krzkrzkrz]

Held the Rebel XT 350D again today and compared it to the grip that was on the Olympus E500 and Olympus E330.

Man was the XT 350D uncomfortable. The sales assistant sarcastically commented that the 350D was designed for women in Japan. I guess this explains the discomfort in the grip.

The D70s (bigger DSLR than the E500 or the 350D) felt comfortable on the hands. Just a bit disappointed now with the 350D.

Liked everything about the camera, especially what I've been reading on in the reviews. But, if I wont feel comfortable holding the camera when I'm taking shots for 30 minutes, then I dont think its worth getting.

[DonSchap]

:cool: <- putting on my dark glasses, cause this is going to be a little rough...

What I find troubling is that anyone serious about the craft would even bother using the XT at all. You'd be better off with a pistol grip on the lens itself. (Oh, now there is a thought...)

The EOS 20D & 30D are definitely designed for the serious APS-C sensor body shooter, both being large enough to offer a "good grip" for the photographer when the extra large and heavier lenses are mounted and even better when you throw on the BG-E2. Just that extra little area for the 'pinky' provides me substantial support to "steady up" the rig. I feel exceptionally vulnerable without it.

I know I simply could not get that from an XT body, even in my wildest dreams. If the XT offering had been all that Canon would have put on the market... they would have never gotten me, my coworkers, my family or extended family as customers. Thank goodness, someone in marketing had the foresight to understand this... and the rest, of course, is history.

So... I believe it is fully understandable why people complain about the XT-body size. Perhaps the next release... (Let me help out here... the 350& 1/2 D, perhaps ?) someone might get a clue and add some air and pump it up inside. God knows air is cheap enough. Even if they designed some kind of "wrap" or snap-on 'body armor'... that would increase the outer body size... that would at least be some kind of solution. It would probably sell like hotcakes. - "A skosh more room... in the GRIP!" -

I can't help but agree with the thinking that this camera is marketed to a smaller-sized population... with hands that match their size. For the sake of argument... let's say the Orient (who would have guessed?). How many folks over there? Oh yeah... like half the world's population, perhaps? I further put forth that the only reason the XT sells well here, in the USA, is because people don't want to pay the rather large gulf in price between the XT and the 20D... so they quickly compromise, having had no experience with larger lenses (heck, the 18-55mm kit weighs all of 9 ounces!) with an uncomfortable fit... and carry on about it, afterwards. I've seen it time and again... standing in the camera shop... watching a returning customer... dissatisfied with the "tiny" starter camera... eventually leading to the sale of either a EOS 20D/30D upgrade... or them storming out, rather angry (understandably so) that they got talked into it in the first place. ("Path of least resistance-sale", I would say... tsk tsk).

Musing further about this: I often wonder how many potential dSLR customers never grow their rigs just because of this initial dissatisfaction? Where they simply refuse to put another dime into a body change/upgrade... but also can't fathom how they'd comfortably manage a larger lens with their tiny XT, either. (I suspect there are a lot of XT-owners that are revolted at this kind of revelation... but in defense, I say it is just a thought, from the other side of reasoning :rolleyes: NO MATTER HOW TRUE IT MAY BE. ;) ).

Brutal honesty can be a real pip... GET THE SHOT! :D

[cdifoto]

What I find troubling is that anyone serious about the craft would even bother using the XT at all. You'd be better off with a pistol grip on the lens itself. (Oh, now there is a thought...)

What I find troubling is that anyone serious about the craft would even bother using Tamron glass at all. You'd be better off with some coke bottle bottoms on the body itself. (Oh, now there is a thought...)



DonS, do you ever realize how absurd you sound? For every one person that bitches there are probably 100 satisfied and/or loving the camera, even its grip.

[pagnamenta]

I agree with Don. I work with both the Rebel XT and the 20D. I find that the Xt's grip is just too small. My pinkie always hangs off or it's on the bottom of the camera. The 20D offers me that extra support. The comes in handy when using heavy lenses and BG-E2.

Whether Canon is marketing to U.S. customers or not, the camera is a hit in Japan. As Don said, the only people that buy the camera in the U.S. are people who don't want to spend the extra for the 20D. These people most likely won't afford an expensive heavy lens, so I would guess tht the XT suffices.

[DonSchap]

I worry about the poor _____ who gets duped into buying one of these cameras... when he/she WILL really need the 20D/30D in the VERY NEAR future. (Like when they eventually get a decent-sized lens ~25oz +).

It just seems a bit contrite to say the Rebel XT is "just as good a fit"... when the initial sale takes place.

I may have been able to get by with a Rebel XT when I used just the TAmROn lenses... because they are exceptionally lightweight... but when I strapped on that Canon EF 70~200mm f/2.8 IS USM... I mean to tell you... the playing field changed!

It's kind of like trying to pull a 12,000 lb trailer with a sport truck! - "What do you mean I need a new transmission? I just bought this!" -

"NEXT!" I say, "20D... and ain't just me."

Thank you for bringing this thread up... it's about time this sales ruse was exposed. (It's just too bad other "potential buyers" can not be made aware, before they get duped.)

[coldrain]

DonSchap, you are really just an annoying guy. Not sure why you find it funny, the way you always exaggerate and stir.

You really manage to make most threads you post in very annoying and worthless. Please, will you at least consider not doing that so often?

[Rhys]

I feel the XT is a pretty good camera if you don't want something big and heavy. It's a nice light, small camera. That's its forte.

It can take decent pictures. There's a whole list of things I find annoying on it but that's by th side.

Tamron lenses are pretty good, IMHO. I've used lenses by Nikon, Canon, Olympus, Sigma, Minolta, Tamron, Vivitar, Miranda, Practika, FED, Zenith etc and find in general that while the manufacturer's lenses tend to be better, quality is generally indicated by price.

I covered an airshow for a magazine with a Sigma 600mm mirror lens in the 1980s. I had no trouble selling the photos. In fact, that was about the only time I really used that lens and since the retail price had shot up, I sold it for what I paid for it, a year later. I believe I used that lens on a Cosina CT1 camera.

I've just sold one Canon lens (my 50mm f1.8. The buyer was decided from 3 candidates within 30 minutes of my placing the advert). I'm on my way toward selling my Tamron 70-300 - that took a little longer at 24 hours but there's no problem selling lenses secondhand so I'd say they're pretty darned good.

I would advise another camera other than the XT BUT... If you must buy an XT then get the BGE3 handgrip with a spare battery.

[aparmley]

I've said this before.

I have large hands. To me the 20Ds and 30Ds are not much bigger than the XTs size-wise. I don't see what all the complaining is about, they are both small cameras. But the 20/30Ds do feel alot more significant in your hands.

[cdifoto]

I've said this before.

I have large hands. To me the 20Ds and 30Ds are not much bigger than the XTs size-wise. I don't see what all the complaining is about, they are both small cameras. But the 20/30Ds do feel alot more significant in your hands.

So speaks the Leader of the Clique! :D

[DonSchap]

I knew my response to this particular thread was going to take some heat from the 350D-community of souls. It's like touching a 'raw nerve' in your tooth... :eek:

Despite the diminutive size of the dwarfish 350D... it still can put some pop in a shot. So... if you can tolerate losing your grip on occasion or struggling to even keep it... by all means, step right up and buy the thing. I wouldn't deny anyone the pleasure of the future annoyance and buyer's remorse you will enjoy... and have been warned of.

Good luck with your new camera! :D

[cdifoto]

I knew my response to this particular thread was going to take some heat from the 350D-community of souls. It's like touching a 'raw nerve' in your tooth... :eek:

Despite the diminutive size of the dwarfish 350D... it still can put some pop in a shot. So... if you can tolerate losing your grip on occasion or struggling to even keep it... by all means, step right up and buy the thing. I wouldn't deny anyone the pleasure of the future annoyance and buyer's remorse you will enjoy... and have been warned of.

Good luck with your new camera! :D


And to think you called L glass owners snobbish (in not so many words)....

Quite the elitist attitude you have considering bodies are throwaways in this digital age. Your own 20D isn't exactly cream of the crop...

[DonSchap]

first choice when weighing into the realm of digital photography. I was shown the Rebel XT and just laughed. Not elitest at all... it was too ___ small for an American made guy standing 6'1" and hands measuring 4.5" across the palms and 8" from wrist to middle finger tip... not the Oriental demographic, thank you.

As "Pagnamenta" mentioned and I paraphrase, most people who will pony up for a heavier lens wouldn't use it on an XT body. It's a beginner's camera... for the most part and gets people sucked into the idea of acquiring additional glass. It's only when they do finally go for that 25oz+ lens that they realize who really got suckered... and the good old 20D, that they ignored months earlier, starts lookin' pretty sweet.

In fact, that call was easy. Picking the correct lensing was the worst part... with all the trouble the manufacturer's were having with diffraction issues and coatings. Then, TAmROn released their Di lenses, and then the Di II for APS-C sensors... and the problem was effectively solved.

Keeping costs down is one thing... but grabbing the right gear is another. I pay for what works... and no more. If I can, I will assist in trying to solve an issue. I know what doesn't work with an XT body... my hands! 'Nuff said! :D

[Rhys]

Size wasn't a problem for me. I liked the fact it was small and light. The problem for me is partly that I've taken a dislike to the camera. I thought I'd got past the intense dislike I had of Canon cameras, based on how horrible they were in the 1990s. The XT simply reaffirmed my dislike. Added to that I find it's a most fiddly camera to operate. I don't have any problem normally with anything technical because I'm a programmer but these twinky little buttons with ever-changing functions plus the fact that I don't have fully independent shutter and aperture control all gets right up my nose.

I bought the BGE3 for the AA battery support (very handy in an emergency). Unfortunately that's now something else I have to sell. I broke my golden rule there of never buying any item-specific accessories.

[DonSchap]

GENERIC battery grip made to accomodate all the different manufacturer's... like Nikon, Canon, Pentax, Konica-Minolta, SONY, SIGMA, Olympus & Phoenix? How could you have possibly avoided buying the item-specific battery grip?

I missed that one?

What is getting into me, 'Rhys'?

Who sells this lil' wonder of which you imply?

And how much does it cost?

Does it just screw into the bottom of the camera body with some kind of universal power cable?

Did someone give you a preliminary Fotokina programme?

[Vich]

There is a product called a "Battery Grip". I thought that's what you ment.

I see you're discussing the ergonomic feel of the camera alone. Adding a Battery Grip to the XT makes it's feel pretty substantial (or so I hear).

As others stated, it's a personal preference thing. I'm 6'3 - fairly big hands (not huge). I dislike cramped cameras, the XT is one of the larger cameras I would categorize as "cramped size". It was actually my wife's preference that tipped the scales for us (she's 5'10). Cramped size was her number 1 complaint on P&S cameras. (sigh, my list was much longer, lol)

I like the 20D, but would prefer bigger. The 20D layout is a bigger deal for me. The wheel on the back (missing on the XT) is a huge comfort item for me. Do a search on people who've upgraded (XT to 20D/30D) and see what they say. I think its rare to not get a "Wow! Love the ergonomics. Night and day". There are exceptions to this "rule".

The 20D/30D Battery Grip doesn't have the best reputation for ergonomics. I've not tried it, but guessing it gives some improvement.

[Rhys]

GENERIC battery grip made to accomodate all the different manufacturer's... like Nikon, Canon, Pentax, Konica-Minolta, SONY, SIGMA, Olympus & Phoenix? How could you have possibly avoided buying the item-specific battery grip?

I missed that one?

What is getting into me, 'Rhys'?

Who sells this lil' wonder of which you imply?

And how much does it cost?

Does it just screw into the bottom of the camera body with some kind of universal power cable?

Did someone give you a preliminary Fotokina programme?

I am puzzled by the way my reply was interpreted. I was simply stating that had I not bought the BGE3 then I would have less to sell (and lose money on). I generally never buy item-specific accessories (fascias for mobile phones, fancy hub-caps for my car etc) as they're a waste of money.

[DonSchap]

I understood that you regreted buying the BG-E3 because there was another OPTION and you had not taken it...

Hey, in my book, "no option... no choice". You wanted AA battery power... the price was a BG-E3. Makes perfect sense to me! You had bought what you needed... I would hardly call that "luxurious". Sounds more like a better handle for your screwdriver.

[Rhys]

I understood that you regreted buying the BG-E3 because there was another OPTION and you had not taken it...

Hey, im my book, "no option... no choice". You wanted AA battery power... the price was a BG-E3. Makes perfect sense to me! You had bought what you needed... I would hardly call that "luxurious". Sounds more like a better handle for your screwdriver.

Ah. Yes.

Well, it is more a case now that I'm really not keen on the XT and think that I might have trouble selling the BGE3 and the 420EX. The XT should go like hotcakes as should the Tamron 28-75. Thus far no enthusiasm for my Tamron 70-300 that I'm trying to sell.

I'm trying to sell it a bit at a time in order that I can get rid of everything. I regret that I have to but I can't really work with a camera that I don't particularly like.

[DonSchap]

POTN? Ebay? FM?

[Rhys]

POTN and FM

[ReF's temporary account]

some of you are frankly full of bullsh*t. the xt is a photographic tool with a certain price point and a certain set of feature for it. it really comes down to how you use it, and your results. yeah that's right PHOTOS. now if you want to say that the size of the grip makes all the difference in this being a "serious" camera or not, well again you're full of $&!#. and you know what else, it's what someone who doesn't know crap about photography or is just plain ignorant would say. so i guess according to you guys a d70 or d50 would be a serious camera and the xt is a toy right? :rolleyes:. and are you guys also saying that if they shrunk the grip on 20d, d200 or whatever it'd be for amatuers? hey, i've used cameras with bigger grips, but that doesn't change what can be done with smaller grip camera.

i've got about $4200 in canon glass (along with a few hundred in accessories) including some moderately sized 3lbs lenses and an external flash attached. now this ain't comfortable to hold by the tiny grip, and i've complained several times about the xt in this regard. but i also realize that a 20d is gonna take the same damn pictures and i don't need to extra spend $$$ on a 20d to convince myself that i'm a serious photographer or fool others into thinking it. no i just need to see the resulting images. and yes, i had the money saved up for a 30d and skipped it because i coudn't justify the cost with the features. i'm planning on having spent about $8000 in photography related equipment by early next year, and part of that cost is a 5d. but thats still not gonna make me think that anyone shooting with less (that includes certain high and mighty 20d/30d owners) isn't "serious"

all you guys who fool yourselves into thinking having better gear makes you better photographers, well better keep your eyes on the competition, cuz some of them are shooting with lesser equipement but have some damn serious skills and the images to go with it.

and please educate yourselves by going to the orient so you can see there are plenty >6' individuals about. what, did you think that there isn't some diversity in such an incredibly huge population? do you guys live in an area with a tiny to zero asian population or something? and where do you think the majority of large gripped cameras are designed? maybe you forgot but that would be japan. Does anyone here seriously think the designers thought the only people who would buy and use the xt would have small hands? Or do you think that it was partially implemented to encourage sales of the 20d?

this harsh reply was totally deserved

[Rhys]

Gee, I hope that wasn't aimed at me!

I don't find the XT's size to be a problem. I just don't particularly like the camera. It's a personal thing. I thought I could live with it like I learnt to live with Nikon's backwards bayonet but I just can't.

[ReF's temporary account]

nothing to do with you rhys.

again it's totally valid to find the xt's grip bothersome (i feel this way myself). it's the crazy conclusions that were drawn

[buruburu]

Back a month ago when I went camera hunting with a friend, we were playing around with the XT and D50. I just didn't feel comfortable gripping the XT. My hands just felt empty. Granted, I have pretty big hands. My friend on the other hand, whose hands were smaller, wrapped around the XT with a perfect fit. In the end to no surprise, he got the XT, I got the D50. Not only did the D50 fit my hand better, the price was a pretty big factor,and I just loved the vivid CCD sensor in the D50. Funny thing is that the vivid CCD turned my friend off, he prefered the more realistic representation on the XT, so the XT was perfect for him.

[DonSchap]

... This harsh reply was totally deserved :eek:

Ref... some of us have some pretty broad shoulders and feel free to heap it on. The remarks I put forth are straight from the heart and I have no desire to debate them. They stand as they are... and the EOS 20D is still... the camera of choice. For the $1000 price tag (current cost), it delivers the punch and supports the lenses beautifully. Bottom line in all this is... it fits yours truly's hand.

Never have I felt the "urge" to go down to the local camera shop and replace it with two (2) Rebel XTs. Perhaps that's my loss... but, I have yet to regret that call.

If a photographer can get the results he seeks from 'the lil' Canon'... more power to 'em. He reaps the benefit of the extra $500 in his pocket. Been there, done that... selling t-shirts with the glass angle of this argument.

You may feel harsh in your response... but, please realize that I have the love of photography in my heart... and know that deep down inside us all... we all want to...


GET THE SHOT! :D

Even if you prefer using a camera obscura (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camera_obscura)

[TenD]

Well said ref...
It's about the photographs, and the XT(which I don't own)can certainly take some fine ones. The grip is small, sure, but that really has nothing to do with taking photos, people take photos with SD700s too...no grip.
I have a lot of heavy Canon glass too, and when taking photographs the lens is always supported with my left hand. The grip makes no difference to me at all for holding my rig. Two fingers Three fingers, just a convenient place to hold on to trip the shutter. Most of the weight is supported by my left hand. Maybe just a hold out habit from manual focus, but I think it's a good habit. When the camera is not up to my eye I am holding it in my left hand by the lens where it meets the body with my strap over my neck. My S2 has a teeny weeny grip, I really don't find it to be any annoyance. I still find my left hand right there under the body supporting it.

[DonSchap]

on that S2 and talk to us about grip action. Everything is relative in this sport. Little hands work with little camera bodies... big hands... 20D/30D. Plain and, apparently, not so simple. LOL :D

[TenD]

:eek:
If a photographer can get the results he seeks from 'the dwarf'...
Even if you are using a camera obscura (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camera_obscura)
Don you are totally entitled to your opinion, yes the grip is small, is that really a reason to completely denounce the camera? You come on like a freight train with opinions stated as fact deriding anyone who owns or thinks of owning an XT(again I don't own one). The 20D is a great camera and was included as my camera of choice in the $6500 experiment. The reason it won over above the 30D is because buy it enabled me to purchase some fine glass with the savings. If I were in the market right now the XT would get a hard long look, because it would allow me to get some great glass along with it. It's in the running for me as a backup body to my 10D. I have only held one in my hands once, and it was OK, yes the grip was small, but like I state above, I hardly use the thing. I just did a quick check with my 10D to see if I was all wet and I used the grip to pull it out of the bag with my 80-200 f/2.8L 3 lb brick mounted on it and as I brought it out I naturally placed my left hand under the tripod ring, then I found I had almost no weight at all in my right hand. I could remove my right hand(the only hand I have that's worth anything, the left one's just for show:) ) to perform any function, such as pulling my non protective CP out to place on the lens. Like I stated above, my technique is born from using a manual focus camera and my left hand just naturally goes up to the lens and supports it.
Your response is of the kind that get's peoples ire up. Maybe you have thick skin, but when you call somebody's pride and joy, or highly researched decision derisive names like "dwarf", and "camera obscura", it makes them angry, stuff like that is pure opinion and it loses credibility when stated in a Smart A$$ manner. The XT is a perfectly viable camera with a small grip, pretty much end of discussion. It doesn't make the image quality any worse, it doesn't change how the lens mounts, it doesn't change the basic function of the camera, at best it's a minor ergonomic nuisance. There are more important considerations than the size of the grip such as the lack of a secondary scroll wheel, or the composite body. But for the budget minded or someone looking for a baby 20D the XT can't be beat.

[DonSchap]

comment was simply that... a reference to the camera obscura (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camera_obscura)... one of the first camera methods developed. If that is what someone wants to use it as their method of photography, they are certainly entitled to do so. That's all that was implied or intended. I did not intend for someone to assume that I meant the Rebel XT (http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ModelDetailAct&fcategoryid=139&modelid=11154) = camera obscura (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camera_obscura). 'TenD', you apparently have made that assumption on your own.

I have no argument with it... it simply is what it is.... a choice. SLR (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Single-lens_reflex_camera) / DSLR (http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ProductCatIndexAct&fcategoryid=111) / pin-hole / Brownie (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brownie_camera) / instamatic / Polaroid (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instant_camera) / 35mm (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/35mm) / 120mm / 110mm / whatever... just...

GET THE SHOT! :D

and if you insist that it be with a Rebel XT... then, so be it. "Can we get a grip here? Waiter? A BG-E3, please... and bring one for my lil' friend." :D

[TenD]

But the XT is a decent camera in it's own right. I shoot with a 10D which BTW is slightly larger than the 20D, and my EOS 3 has an even larger grip. Using my left hand to support the weight of the rig and my right to take the shot, I can use any to take the same shot with any lens on it. This lends itself to much better shutter control also, my right hand is free to move, bearing very little weight, I can finesse the shutter release.
My AE-1 had no grip at all, and my A-1 had something but really didn't have any grip to speak of either. How did I ever get on with my FD 300mm f/4L? Look at the older pre AF SLRs, none had much to speak of as far as a grip. Somehow people muddled through....with no:eek:grip. Much of the success, had to do with proper camera holding technique. I was taught that technique in my very first photography class, it works, I have used it ever since.
It's a point that should be brought up, the XT has a pretty small grip. But even with this "handicap" it can still certainly take great photos that stand up to any camera out there, especially if you use the savings on the body to buy some good glass.

[DonSchap]

But the XT is a decent camera in it's own right. I shoot with a 10D which BTW is slightly larger than the 20D, and my EOS 3 has an even larger grip. Using my left hand to support the weight of the rig and my right to take the shot, I can use any to take the same shot with any lens on it. This lends itself to much better shutter control also, my right hand is free to move, bearing very little weight, I can finesse the shutter release.
My AE-1 had no grip at all, and my A-1 had something but really didn't have any grip to speak of either. How did I ever get on with my FD 300mm f/4L? Look at the older pre AF SLRs, none had much to speak of as far as a grip. Somehow people muddled through....with no:eek:grip. Much of the success, had to do with proper camera holding technique. I was taught that technique in my very first photography class, it works, I have used it ever since.
It's a point that should be brought up, the XT has a pretty small grip. But even with this "handicap" it can still certainly take great photos that stand up to any camera out there, especially if you use the savings on the body to buy some good glass.

While I also have a EOS-3... it doesn't get the work-out the 20D does. I find myself shooting in a variety of stances... and sometimes... in the adjustment of studio lighting and what not... one-handed.

Below are a pair of shots I took one-handed, tonight, with the EF 70-200mm f/2.8 IS USM lens mounted on the 20D w/ BG-E2 grip. One was with IS off and the other... not off.

IS off
13740

IS not off
13741

Warning: Folks, do not try this with a Rebel XT and this lens... or chance losing your rig. :eek: I am a trained non-professional photographer sporting an EOS 20D.

Hey, I know this opinion is not popular. I tried to make that point clear, right up front and I'm still getting "whacked" for being upfront about it. Every other post agrees with the fact the grip is hard on a body... but yet, I'm the bad guy for saying it's not for moi? Like I said, Canon could design a "wrap" or "grip expander" of some type to ease this issue out a bit. Please do not defend them for not stepping up. There is a need, so get a grip.

[coldrain]

That is the problem Don(Schap). You never say it is not for YOU. You say something is rubbish, and that no one should want it. You have done that now with the XT/350D, with Canon lenses, with Sigma lenses and what not. When you do not have it, it is rubbish. Just read your own posts and you will see why you always seem to get people mad with your nonsensical and biased posts full of fake facts.

It is fine to say a camera or other product is not for YOU. But that is not what you do.

[DonSchap]

Here's a slightly cheaper idea for a grip assist... for the Rebel XT.

The Opteka Battery Grip (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000G3KLPA/ref=nosim/104-9039863-2475103?n=502394)... which is like half the oprice of the Canon BG-E3.

Seems like a heck of a bargain for extra grip and two rechargeables. Awesome!

[CptOfGondor]

Don, that is possibly the most insane gear list I've ever seen. ! :eek:

[DonSchap]

a bad or good thing? :rolleyes:

Can you imagine the "group photo" of all that stuff? :rolleyes:

Wait until I add the SONY A100 and its line of specialty items... :rolleyes:

The insurance tag on all that is nearly $10,000 (I shudder) :o

[krzkrzkrz]

Over the weekend I travelled to Singapore for a special purpose. To my surprise I met a friend who was an architect and he had a Canon Rebel XT 350D to take with him as a side hobby. He has had the camera for almost 5 months now and I was able to hold it once again, but this time with the batter grip.

The battery grip did make a small difference as it sheltered my pinky from sliding off the grip. However, it did not do too much in accomodating my long fingers.

He also noted that he is thinking of selling the Rebel XT because of the grip issue and getting a 5D.

In addition, he also pointed out that after holding the XT for several minutes, your fingers start to strain!

[DonSchap]

Over the weekend I travelled to Singapore for a special purpose. To my surprise I met a friend who was an architect and he had a Canon Rebel XT 350D to take with him as a side hobby. He has had the camera for almost 5 months now and I was able to hold it once again, but this time with the batter grip.

The battery grip did make a small difference as it sheltered my pinky from sliding off the grip. However, it did not do too much in accomodating my long fingers.

He also noted that he is thinking of selling the Rebel XT because of the grip issue and getting a 5D.

In addition, he also pointed out that after holding the XT for several minutes, your fingers start to strain!

You might want to ask "Coldrain" about this... and see what relief he can suggest. He shoots with the Rebel XT and has tech-level answer for darn anything. My personal, non-technical (call it "practical", for lack of a better term) solution was a 20D... not a 5D. I guess if I had popped for a 5D... I'd have had $2000 less to spend on lenses and things... and the UWA lenses would have become a moot issue.

Good luck in whatever you decide... :D

[jamison55]

The funny thing about the size complaints about the XT is that camera trends have favored smaller cameras for the average consumer. Back in the late 70's early 80's Olympus had a huge hit with the OM series because they were around the smallest SLR's you could buy (I didn't witness this personally - I was only a few years old, but an older photographer at my company is always raving about the size breakthrough of the oly OM series). Take a look at Canon's consumer film line - the Rebel. It is much smaller than the Elan series because that's what the target market wants.

I'll admit that I was put off by the diminutive size of the XT when I first played with one, but after owning one for a few months now, I find it very carryable. The XT with a light prime (50 f1.8) or zoom (28-105 f3.5-4.5 II) is the combo I choose (over the 20D and 30D) when I'm not doing a professional gig. I don't notice a difference at all in my handholdability with the standard glass.

After I bought the 70-200IS, I bought a grip for the XT because it was very difficult to hold such a heavy lens with such a small grip - but then again, the average consumer who buys an XT will probably never mount more then the kit lens on it (i.e. the vast majority who DON'T visit online forums). FWIW - when I bought the 30D to replace the XT in my pro bag, I bought the grip for it b/c even the extra heft of the 30D is not enough of a grip for me for that beast.

PS - I'm 6'2" and my middle finger is 4.5" when fully extended...

[Rhys]

You might want to ask "Coldrain" about this... and see what relief he can suggest. He shoots with the Rebel XT and has tech-level answer for darn anything.

ROTFL. He sounds authoratative until you question the factual accuracy of the postings Coldran makes. As to whether he shoots with an XT or not, since he's apparently never read the manual - particularly page 134 on which it states that the XT has a focal plane shutter - I don't know. I don't even know if he has the camera he claims or whether his claims are hot air. Anybody seen any photos taken by Coldrain using his dSLR?

[DonSchap]

that the Canon Rebel XT is just an "entry camera", for the most part... and you can get what TRUE dSLRs are all about with the purchase of the EOS 20D/30D instead... and probably be happier in the long run. Nothing that has been said here has changed my opinion other than strengthening my conviction about buying the more robust 20D.

Those who have Rebel XTs... I wish you many happy shots.

It's not like a photographer would ever gain anything by going from a 20D to an XT... so why bother with the darn thing, anyway? Just pop for the extra coin and get the EOS 20D or 30D and work with it. You efforts will eventually pay off. Perfect your craft and quit wasting money on something you are eventually going toss off to the side... WHEN YOU UPGRADE YOUR REAL CAMERA BODY! (A nod to 'AP' ;) )

Like 'Rhys' says, he's having trouble dumping the body specific parts, like the BG-E3.

Obviously... I have lenses I will probably never use, again. They were bought as test efforts to see if digital would work for me... and now they collect shelf dust, six months later. Hopefully, some "newbie" will come along and I can hand them off to that person so they can get some mileage out of them.

This all rather personalized... and while the Rebel XT may be "perfect" :rolleyes: in the hands of some people, who have decided on the Canon line as their choice... I'm here to say that going to the Canon EOS 20D/30D may be the "best FIRST decision" you can make... and one you won't have to back peddle on, later.

Practically speaking, that, my friends, should be good enough!

[aparmley]

ROTFL. He sounds authoratative until you question the factual accuracy of the postings Coldran makes. As to whether he shoots with an XT or not, since he's apparently never read the manual - particularly page 134 on which it states that the XT has a focal plane shutter - I don't know. I don't even know if he has the camera he claims or whether his claims are hot air. Anybody seen any photos taken by Coldrain using his dSLR?

Ya - He posts his images from time to time - They're usually pretty good. ;)

[aparmley]

It's not like a photographer would ever gain anything by going from a 20D to an XT... so why bother with the darn thing, anyway? Just pop for the extra coin and get the EOS 20D or 30D and work with it. You efforts will eventually pay off. Perfect your craft and quit wasting money on something you are eventually going toss off to the side... WHEN YOU UPGRADE YOUR REAL CAMERA BODY! (A nod to 'AP' ;) )


[looking around; points finger to chest; tim the tool man taylors patented "arrrrrooooooh?]

The XT served me well. Prepared me for my upgrade very nicely. . . The transition was completely smooth -Because of the XT I was able to not only recognize but also fully appreciate the 30Ds operational superiority and The addition of more controls was welcomed instead of perhaps being dumbfounded by all the buttons and options like some may have experienced.

I don't think I'd have a problem dumping the BG-E3 - they are $149 new the XT is still a hot camera. Pricing it to move like $100 should make it easy to sell.

[ReF's temporary account]

that the Canon Rebel XT is just an "entry camera", for the most part... and you can get what TRUE dSLRs are all about with the purchase of the EOS 20D/30D instead... and probably be happier in the long run. Nothing that has been said here has changed my opinion other than strengthening my conviction about buying the more robust 20D.

Those who have Rebel XTs... I wish you many happy shots.

It's not like a photographer would ever gain anything by going from a 20D to an XT... so why bother with the darn thing, anyway? Just pop for the extra coin and get the EOS 20D or 30D and work with it. You efforts will eventually pay off. Perfect your craft and quit wasting money on something you are eventually going toss off to the side... WHEN YOU UPGRADE YOUR REAL CAMERA BODY! (A nod to 'AP' ;) )

Like 'Rhys' says, he's having trouble dumping the body specific parts, like the BG-E3.

Obviously... I have lenses I will probably never use, again. They were bought as test efforts to see if digital would work for me... and now they collect shelf dust, six months later. Hopefully, some "newbie" will come along and I can hand them off to that person so they can get some mileage out of them.

This all rather personalized... and while the Rebel XT may be "perfect" :rolleyes: in the hands of some people, who have decided on the Canon line as their choice... I'm here to say that going to the Canon EOS 20D/30D may be the "best FIRST decision" you can make... and one you won't have to back peddle on, later.

Practically speaking, that, my friends, should be good enough!


wait, we heard all this already :eek: just a few pages back. let this pointless thread die already

[DonSchap]

Hear, hear!

13964

Ref... you might want to read this thread from POTN (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=196186)... it made me laugh when I thought about this discussion.

[ReF's temporary account]

no offense if you meant it as a friendly gesture and i didn't find it funny. it's totally what i expect from people in general - as in there will be those that overspend on stuff they don't need and don't know how to use, those that make fun of them or look down on them, those that say "let'm be," and those that do make use of the money they spent. it's all just normal human behavior

[Rhys]

no offense if you meant it as a friendly gesture and i didn't find it funny. it's totally what i expect from people in general - as in there will be those that overspend on stuff they don't need and don't know how to use, those that make fun of them or look down on them, those that say "let'm be," and those that do make use of the money they spent. it's all just normal human behavior

I tend to agree. We shouldn't laugh at people that fall for marketing hype and buy products that are unsuitable. I can't remember ever buying something that I never managed to get to grips with. Sure, the XT was a huge leap from what I'd been using before and that took a lot of adjusting - most of which I was not at all keen on. I suppose it's like my mobile phones - once you have one, the others are not such a learning experience.

We do tend to mock people more than we really should (in fact, we shouldn't mock people at all). I have no problem with helping those that don't know things. I do get irked by those that ask for help and then don't want help but require a slave to do things for them.

The people we can laugh at are the people that buy item X because their neighbour has the previous version of item X; and buy that in order to prove they're "with it" or "better". Neighbours in Britain used to buy new cars to show off to their neighbours to prove their egos were bigger etc. Boring!

[DonSchap]

no offense if you meant it as a friendly gesture and i didn't find it funny. it's totally what i expect from people in general - as in there will be those that overspend on stuff they don't need and don't know how to use, those that make fun of them or look down on them, those that say "let'm be," and those that do make use of the money they spent. it's all just normal human behavior

I behind you one hundred and fifty per cent. There are so many different degrees of knowledge, experience and purchasing power represented on here... I can truly appreciate your not wanting to hear any opinion other than... the one you want to hear. Misery wants company, they say.

Personally... I like getting it right, THE FIRST TIME, if I can. Buying less than what I need is no fun, either. In fact, my friend, I find it down right dishonest if a salesman sells me something because it was the first thing I looked at. A little more discussion of the options and possibile alternatives is far more fair, in my personal experience.

So... if I can, I will also try to assist others in the pursuit of BETTER pictures... and if it requires me to offer something better than a Canon Rebel XT... w/ the kung-fu grip... dog gone it, I'm going choke it up and offer it.

You have a nice day and remember, respect other people's opinions... they may just have a point. Who knew???