TZ1 - focusing on Jupiter

[djotai]

It might seem a bit presumptuous, but I'm trying to shoot Jupiter with its moons. Using a tripod and the timer, at X10 on normal mode, my biggest problem is that the camera only managed to correctly focus on the planet 4 times out of some 20 trials. My point is - if it CAN do it once, why does it
fail in other attempts with all other parameters being the same ?
(I'll post some pics after I figure out how to attach them)

Any recommendations ?

BTW, this little camera is a real wonder - I used to be (at least) indifferent to photography, pics never came out the way I wanted - no more! in the last 2 weeks I've shot some 1500 photos and I'd estimate only 5 or 6 were bad (and these were due to MY shortcomings). Whatever I ask of it, in whichever situation - the pic comes out exactly as I want. This is really fun !

[genece]

The camera if like the FZ cameras, uses contrast to focus.
So the exposure needs to be close to correct so there is a contrast edge.
Then to set the camera so its focus area is pointed at the edge with a cheap tripod may be close to impossible.

Considering the size of Jupiter it may take quite a few attempts.

Then again I do not have a TZ1 so I may be totally wrong.

[tim11]

Welcome back Gene. I thought you wouldn't be posting anymore.

[seemolf]

So I had to focus the moon, fix the focus and search the jupiter.
http://www.geocities.com/seemolf/pictures/moon.html
Sven

[djotai]

To Gene, Hi
Can't say I understood much from your answer, but thanks for the tips - you've given me some starting points for a study I must do on the net.

Sven
I must say that the Moon performed much better. Pics to come. I tried "copying"
the focus as you suggested - great idea btw - but jupiter's disc looks much larger
than in the "good" pics, and the moons dots are invisible, suggesting out-of-focus.
In the TZ1 I can only fix the focus within the "Underwater" scene mode.
The "good" pics were recorded in the Night Scenery scene mode with its 8 seconds
exposure and the objects appear as trails. I haven't even gotten to solving THIS problem yet...

Djotai.

[genece]

A lot of what seems like out of focus is really overexposure.....you need to get the exposure correct so you can focus.

If you over expose the moon even with a Manual focus camera set on infinity
the result will be a big white blob.

I just am not sure how you get a correct exposure with the TZ1.

If you can change metering modes try spot metering and spot focus.....that may not be possible with the TZ1 , I am not familiar with that camera.

[David Metsky]

Can't you set the focus to infinity using one of the modes, like landscape mode? You don't need to focus on Jupiter, you need to set the focus to infinity, right?

-dave-

[djotai]

Hi Gene
Metering is set to Multiple, Focus to 1 area high speed. Will try your recommended...

Hello Dave
The problem is that before the camera shoots, it tries - and fails - to refocus on the coming exposure, effectively forgetting the previous setting. The only way to fix the focus is within a certain scene mode, for underwater use.

I'll try to attach 2 pics, handheld shots of the Moon, X10 & x1, no PP.

Djotai

[djotai]

Here goes -
The first 3 are X10, then one on X10+X4 Digital. All done on tripod, timer, in Night Scenery scene mode. No PP.
The 4 streaks closest to the planet are moons. Some stars are also apparent in the field. I still have'nt figured out why pics 3 &4 have a lighter background.
I think these demonstrate the feasibility of what I want to achieve, although I now understand better the difficulties.

Djotai

[David Metsky]

Have you tried landscape? It locks the focus at infinity on my Canon and Olympus, the camera doesn't try to focus at all. It's not a scene mode, it gets set like putting the camera into macro mode.

Anyways, good luck.

-dave-

[genece]

I would try spot focus and the smallest metering pattern the TZ1 has
(center weighted or spot)

And 8 seconds or 15 seconds is much too long to expose on the moon or I suppose the planets without a tracking tripod.

While it may defeat what you are trying to accomplish I would set the aperture as small as it will go (F7 maybe). And the shutter speed to get a correct exposure, the photos of jupiter are way overexposed...but I understand what you arre trying for..... but I do not think you have the correct equiptment for that.

[gwhizkids]

Wow! Even though overexposed, the shots of Jupiter are still impressive. You can clearly discern the cloud banding. I'm going to have to give this a try.

Keep posting your efforts, too.

[djotai]

Hello Friends
Gene
Granted, TZ1 wasn't designed for this ! :D
But still, trying to push the envelope, coax the machine to serve - I find it challenging. Especially the Jupiter scene - you know, for a young person, a beginner in Astronomy, the first sight of Jupiter and its moons through a small telescope or binoculars always elicits this "Ahhh" which I enjoy to hear... the breathing stops for a while as the picture sinks in... I'd like to record this view by this simple means - a p&s camera.
I managed to take just 1 pic tonight - cloudy - it was the first shot of the evening using your recommendations (spot focus & metering) and Dave's idea - the Scenery scene. On Slow shutter, for the first and only time, I managed to get a green focus signal for the shot!
Alas, I destroyed the original somehow while doing the crop. But the latter is here and I managed to study the original carefully.
Firstly, judging by the size of the disc, it seems the focus was at least ok if not perfect in many pics, even though the camera signalled "no focus".
Secondly, even in this sharp photo there is no trace of moons or stars, as is the case in all non skewed photos.
It seems that the apparent magnitude of the moons is too high to register on the CCD, i.e. they're too faint compared with the planet. Must overexpose jupiter to record its moons.
The 8 sec exposures achieved this at the cost of skewed pictures.

Dave
The TZ1 in Scenery scene doesn't lock focus, but "preferrentially focuses on more distant objects" - 5 m to infinity. I hope I can repeat the green signal on subsequent shots.

Gwhizkids
I'm afraid I can't see anything on this small surfce. The bands are very clear these days though, and are oriented roughly 10-4 o'clock. Thanks for the encouragement !

Must continue to study...

First pic is the leftover crop, second is Jupiter through a thick cloud -could'nt see it with the naked eye. Both X10.

Djotai

[Telecorder]

I had better success with my FZ5 doing an eyepiece projection into the lens...

[djotai]

Hello friends
Got it !
It's nothing like your magnificently detailed results Telecorder, but it's exactly what I wanted - the view through a small telescope or binoculars, achieved with just the TZ1 and tripod, and no PP.
The solution was amazingly simple, almost primitive.
I used the "Night scenery" scene with its 8 seconds exposure. 2 or 3 seconds after the shutter opened, I put my hand in front of the lens obstructing further exposing. Thus I could get roughly any exposure time UP TO 8 seconds. This longer exposure let in enough light for details to register, but was'nt long enough to cause skewing.
OIS was off, Slow shutter at -1, pict size 3 M, quality best, aspect ratio 4:3, flash forced off, AF mode spot, cont AF off, AF assist on (other parameters are auto in this scene).
The first 2 pics were shot like that. The other 2 used the High sensitivity which gives more details at the expense of noise.
There are 4 moons visible, and 2 stars. Jupiter's glare makes it difficult to discern the closest 2 moons, but I expect better results in the following evenings as their positions change.
I'll experiment further to get as good a photo as possible and post my results as they improve.
Next target - Saturn !

Thank you all for the help and encouragement.

Djotai

[Telecorder]

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d73/Telecorder/FZ5%20Digiscoping/Jupiter-Moons-May-2006.jpg

[calee]

Here is a moon shot taken with my new FZ7 using the Starry Sky setting with the focus setting on continuous.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v475/calee/Funnies/P1000557_edited.jpg

[Telecorder]

But possibly could have been better if the exposure had been metered for the brightest portion of the moon so as not to have it over-exposed.

The 1/4-second exposure was too slow for the light. As a suggestion, when in doubt try bracketed exposure with spot-AF & spot-exposure aimed at the brightest portion of the moon. This will allow you to get a better exposed image. The EXIF indicates you used pattern (9-area?) for the exposure so it had a lot of black sky and a bit of bright that it tried to expose for...

You can then adjust, in an image processing software such as Google's free Picasa2, to adjust for lightening the darker areas...

So, how do you like your FZ7?

[calee]

Thanks for the tips....I'm quite pleased with the FZ7. It has many improvements over my Olympus 740 and will suite my needs perfectly. All of my accessories are 55mm from my SLR days and, as with the Olympus, I added an adapter to the FZ allowing me to continue using them.

[djotai]

13410Hi
Here's a TZ1 take on the subject. overcoming overexposure was'nt easy, and it still is'nt THE photo I want. Still studying...

Djotai