Nikon D50 vs. Olympus E-500

[Bearsfan]

Brief explanation of my circumstances: I'm 20 years old. I'm essentially new to photography. I've always had a off-and-on interest in it, and I took a photography class in high school, but I have never taken the time to really invest in it, nor have I ever owned a respectable digital camera. I'm now thinking about taking up photography as an actual hobby, and am looking at possibly purchasing a digital SLR camera. Through sites like dpreview.com and amazon.com, I've essentially narrowed it down to the two mentioned in this thread title, but here are my answers to the recommended questions to respond to...

Budget
$800 or less. Willing to purchase a slightly more expensive camera used if necessary. Ideally looking for something in the $500-700 range.

Size
No real preference, but not too small. I'd prefer it feel comfortable and solid, rather than cramped.

Features
As mentioned, I'm new to D-SLRs and photography and general, but I'll do my best. As far as megapixels go, I'd like as good of image quality as possible for my budget, so no less than 6MP. Importance of image quality to me, on a scale of 1-10, is probably a 9 or 10. I'd like the camera to have both automatic modes and optional manual controls, so that I could go either route. I'd like to learn how to use and take advantage of all the manual features of an SLR, so a fair amount of them is important to me.

General Usage
I plan to mostly do my photography outdoors in natural settings. I live in the Northwest, where there are many cloudy, dreary days (low light), as well as trees and natural growth. However, I'd like the camera to be flexible enough to take on trips and use in sunlight as well. I do not necessarily plan to make large prints of any pictures, though that may come up at some point.

Miscellaneous
I have no preference as far as brands go, given I have almost no experience with them. However, as already mentioned, through other websites I've essentially narrowed my options down to the Nikon D50 and the Olympus E-500, with the Canon 350D another camera I'm somewhat considering as well. But I'm also willing to take any other suggestions. So if anybody who reads this thinks a completely different camera (even non-SLR) may be better suited to my needs, my ears (or eyes) are open.

Regarding special features, I'd like it to be tripod mountable of course. Image stabilization would be nice, but not essential. Weatherproof would probably be preferable, considering the outdoor and dreary nature of my intended use of it. And... that's about it, at least as far as can say with my limited knowledge.

With all that said, I would greatly appreciate any advice or recommendations anybody here can give me. I will check this thread for responses. I can also be reached by e-mail (bearsfan@3dnorth.com) or AIM (duzkt) if you'd rather contact me that way, or have any further questions to ask.

Thanks ahead of time. :)

[timmciglobal]

Nothing sub a few grand is weatherproof.

The 350D and D50 are close, I'd get the D70s though for the fact of the nicer lens between it and the D50.

I'm a canon guy but for your use they are pretty close and spot metering is nice on the D70.

Tim

[coldrain]

Nothing sub a few grand is weatherproof.

The 350D and D50 are close, I'd get the D70s though for the fact of the nicer lens between it and the D50.

I'm a canon guy but for your use they are pretty close and spot metering is nice on the D70.

Tim
The D50 is a little bit better than the D70s, even though it lacks some of the D70s' features. The "lens" is better? Both kit lenses aren't all that amazing, and you can buy them without. And you can buy the D50 with the 18-70 lens of the D70s kit if you want. So i do not see what the "lens" makes the D70s the preferable option. Other factors maybe, but not the kit lens.

About weatherproofness: The Canon 350D can be made "weatherproof" very cheaply when needed. Lenses like the 17-40mm f4 L are weather sealed I think, and with a clear plastic showercap that costs next to nothing at any pharmacy or so you can make a hole in the side and put the weatherproof lens through the hole, your hands go inside the caps opening on the bottom. You may look like an idiot, but this will enable you to photograph in rainy weather and make shots you otherwise would not have had.

The only way to have image stabilization is to either get a nikon with VR lenses, a Canon with IS lenses (or both with OS lenses from sigma) or a konica minolta 5D which has its sensor doing the IS part.

[Norm in Fujino]

Nothing sub a few grand is weatherproof.

Gotta say this, but the Olympus E-1 is weatherproof, and it's selling for around $1000 right now.

[coldrain]

Gotta say this, but the Olympus E-1 is weatherproof, and it's selling for around $1000 right now.
Which lenses will be weatherproof?

[Norm in Fujino]

Which lenses will be weatherproof?

I haven't looked for any printed data about it, but according to others on the DPreview Olympus forum, all the "high grade" and "super high grade" are weather sealed. Only the cheapest kit grade lenses are not. That would include the 14-45, the 40-150, the 18-180 and the 35 macro.
I've heard guys talking about taking their E-1 in the shower with them (why!?), so I guess that's good enough. --I'm providing this info only as a service, and not because I'm willing to stake my life on it. Although I suppose it makes sense that if the E-1 body is weatherproofed as Oly asserts, then it would be silly not to provide weatherproofed lenses for it.

Update: Here's an Olympus site that describes the lenses as "dust and splashproof":
http://www.olympus-esystem.com/dea/products/lens/index.html

[Bearsfan]

Weatherproof isn't critical, I just thought it might be nice if I want to take pictures on a rainy day. But I'm sure I could make do with a camera that's not weatherproof. Right now I'm really leaning towards the E-500. But I'm still open to any other suggestions, including non-SLR.

Thanks to those who have offered their advice so far.

[speaklightly]

Bearsfan-

Well, www.dpreview.com just awarded the Olympus E-500 a high prized "highly recommended" classification. That is pretty impressive.

SarahJoyce

[Rambler358]

Another option for consideration might be Konica-Minolta's Maxxum 5D. There's a nice review of it here:
http://www.steves-digicams.com/2005_reviews/maxxum5d.html

[Bearsfan]

Yeah, I was comparing with the Konica Minolta 5D tonight. I've pretty much narrowed my search down to the Olympus E-500, the Canon 350D, and the Konica Minolta 5D now. I really like the features, price, and general appeal of the Olympus E-500 more than the other two. But according to dpreview.com (and the samples they provide), the 350D is better at higher ISOs, so that might be a better option for shooting in low-light, dreary conditions. And what I like about the Konica Minolta is its image stabilization.

If the E-500 had a little more sharpness and better quality at higher ISOs, that would probably be my choice hands down. I'll probably go to an actual store next to try some of these out hands on to help me decide.

Thanks again to everybody here who's helped.

[Rambler358]

Yeah, I was comparing with the Konica Minolta 5D tonight. I've pretty much narrowed my search down to the Olympus E-500, the Canon 350D, and the Konica Minolta 5D now. I really like the features, price, and general appeal of the Olympus E-500 more than the other two. But according to dpreview.com (and the samples they provide), the 350D is better at higher ISOs, so that might be a better option for shooting in low-light, dreary conditions. And what I like about the Konica Minolta is its image stabilization.
Not to take away anything from the E-500, but it does have a smaller CCD with a 2x lens factor. The smaller CCD will mean more noise at higer ISO levels, so it's not the best low-light camera of the bunch. Still a great camera though. And you can't go by specs alone. Definately get a chance to hold each of them and see how they feel in your hands.

[Rex914]

If budget is an issue, Canon is running triple rebates right now, and you can get the 350D really, really cheap ($525) if you buy the right things. If there's a Costco in your area, they have some incredible bundles, and if you don't like it, they have the most lax return policy out there.

[rob67]

First of all. Using the d50 and the rebel in the same sentence is ok. Using the d70 in the equasion is not ok. The d70 is hands down better than either. I have an E-1 (the price has dropped dramaticaly) It is exceptional. BUT, its full manual only, so if you want to point and shoot, get the e-500. Also, the four thirds system is soo much nicer...Another thing noone mentioned to you is that every time you change lenses, you will get dust on your sensor. This equates to photoshoping every picture you take. The olympus system (300,330,500,e-1) is the only system in the world that has an anti dust sensor. That is why I put my nikon on ebay. Do some research on the 4/3 system. and the anti dust. It might make the descision for you.
Good luck.

[Jason25]

The D70 is comparable to the Rebel. In fact, they were compared before the D50 was even released. I've had 1 speck of dust in the 4 1/2 months I've had my D50. What kind of lens-changing technique were you using? ;)

[timmciglobal]

The D50 is a fantastic camera, in fact I'd never buy a D70 because of the moire issue and the higher noise then the D50's sensor.

D200 is a different beast.

D50 and XT are fantastic choices and very good values.

Tim

[Jason25]

The D50 is a fantastic camera, in fact I'd never buy a D70 because of the moire issue and the higher noise then the D50's sensor.

D200 is a different beast.

D50 and XT are fantastic choices and very good values.

Tim
Sometimes, some of the extra features tempt me to trade up to the D70s, to be honest. I do love my D50 though, it produces some outstanding images, and the noise handling is fantastic.

[timmciglobal]

Buy an SB-800. That's the only thing the D70 offers that I think is really nice. The unlit LCD can be a little annoying but a 10$ LED light can fix that.

Tim

[Jason25]

Buy an SB-800. That's the only thing the D70 offers that I think is really nice. The unlit LCD can be a little annoying but a 10$ LED light can fix that.

Tim
Well, I guess I don't have to be tempted anymore, and will just wait :)

http://www.dcresource.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18583

[D70FAN]

The D50 is a fantastic camera, in fact I'd never buy a D70 because of the moire issue and the higher noise then the D50's sensor.

D200 is a different beast.

D50 and XT are fantastic choices and very good values.

Tim

So, for as much as I like the D50 for what it is, I'm starting to get tired of the D70 getting a bad rap, from people who wouldn't know a good dSLR design if it bit them in the ass.

What #$@% moire issue? In 13,000 frames I have seen moire in maybe 4 or 5 and would be hard pressed to find them as they were boring as hell test shots of a screen door. Ultimately, NC4 took care of it. Admittedly, the noise differences are there, but pretty marginal. At ISO1600 you would end up using Noise Ninja with pretty much any dSLR for any print larger than 5 x 7.

So a few questions:

When was the last time you used the internal flash on the D50 to control an external SB600/800 in speedlight Commander mode?

When was the last time you shot at 1/5000sec?

Can you read that info LCD at night?

Can you set aperture and exposure without taking your eye from the viewfinder (the D70 has 2 command wheels)?

Can you set ISO in 1/3 stop increments (most times I don't really need ISO1600)?

Can you display a grid pattern on the display for accurate horizon allignment?

[Jason25]

So a few questions:

Can you read that info LCD at night?

Can you set aperture and exposure without taking your eye from the viewfinder (the D70 has 2 command wheels)?

Can you set ISO in 1/3 stop increments (most times I don't really need ISO1600)?

Can you display a grid pattern on the display for accurate horizon allignment?
Those are big reasons I've been tempted to swap up. Plus the DoF preview.

[timmciglobal]

Is there a noise difference @ ISO 1250 vs ISO 1600? I use Auto ISO on the D50, greatest feature ever, Set a min shutter speed and welcome to "ISO 975" and "iso 1050"

Do you use remote flashes?

They've got AF grids, they work well too.

X-sync is the same on the D50.

If the D70 didn't have the poor (relative) noise performance and moire issues I wouldn't knock it as much. Plus it's not worth the extra money imho for the "commander mode" I'd rather someone buy a sb-800 with the extra and get a D50 then D70 just to command wireless flashes.

Tim

[D70FAN]

Is there a noise difference @ ISO 1250 vs ISO 1600? I use Auto ISO on the D50, greatest feature ever, Set a min shutter speed and welcome to "ISO 975" and "iso 1050"

Do you use remote flashes?

They've got AF grids, they work well too.

X-sync is the same on the D50.

If the D70 didn't have the poor (relative) noise performance and moire issues I wouldn't knock it as much. Plus it's not worth the extra money imho for the "commander mode" I'd rather someone buy a sb-800 with the extra and get a D50 then D70 just to command wireless flashes.

Tim

Ya got me. The D50 has viewfinder gridlines. I must have been thinking of the XT.:o

I didn't mention x-sync... The shutter speed was 1/5000sec., not 1/500sec.

Sorry, the rest is baseless opinion. The D50 uses the same sensor and anti-aliasing filter as the D70(s) (the source of moire'). I did give the edge to the D50 and XT for marginally better high ISO noise performance. But I already said that.

Use a D70(s) for a week or two. If you know anything about photography, at a level above point-n-shoot, you will not go back to the D50.