Great camera ..lousey company service

[genece]

I just have to do this as I feel Panasonic is not willing to treat me fairly.
I bought a FZ30 from Panasonic USA on the 2nd of Sept.
And I love the camera and I am sure most of you are tired of me telling you that.
But the camera has developed a foreign object inside the lens.
Here is a photo showing the object inside the red circle it seems to be a piece of metal but it does not move. And while at this time it does not seem to show up in the photos I still think it should be taken care of.


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v463/genece/defectMedium.jpg

I had a photo of the lens showing a thin Hoya filter mounted and it clearly showed that the speck was not there on the 10th of Sept. but I have discarded that photo.

Here is the reply from Panasonic USA about the speck and I do not feel that is a good option as I am sure there are no parts available for repair as I have tried to purchase another lens hood and was told they will not be available until November.
I feel Panasonic should replace the camera but they refuse.
So while I was waiting for their 4/3rds camera , that has all changed.
Heres their Email reply to my request.

Thank you for your inquiry. We are unable to replace the model at this
time. The camera will have to be checked by our authorized service
technician. Please send your camera to the Independent Authorized Service
Center listed below.

Bigston Digital Service
1590 Touhy Avenue
Elk Grove Village, IL 60007
1-888-439-2676

Thank You,
Panasonic Consumer Support

I wrote back and filed a form on their support site but I have not received a reply.
Suprise ...suprise.

[eastbluffs]

First, the placement of that dust probably won't affect photo quality. Such particals are not uncommon on DSLR lenses - I don't know about P&S cameras but the impact is the same - none. So I wouldn't get too up in arms about it.

Do you have photos that demonstrate that it impacts yur photos?

I'm not sure the best way to do it. Probably something blue close up, then use photoshop to play with the levels.

Second; a photo of dust can be difficult to make. The light has to hit it just right. To be fair, it may have been there before. However, if it was new they shouldn't have shipped it like that (I suppose).

The QC guy, if he saw it, probably figured it wasn't important.

Third; canon cleaned the sensor on my DSLR for free the first time. Dust in DSLRs are commonplace due to lense changes and using lenses with much larger volume (therefore greater vacumes during zoom). It was pretty filthy (probably 100 spots when I shot a blue sky then pushed up the levels in photoshop). Howeverr; 99% of the shots didn't reveal anything so I didn't even bother with it for 3 months.

Lastly; if they offer to look at it, they will most likely clean it. Personally; if the camera takes great shots and all, I wouldn't want them monkeying with it over something so minor. But most likely their authorized center knows how to take it apart and put it back and calibrate it properly (I'm not that trusting)

Since your 30 days isn't up yet, you may consider getting a 5 year MACK warranty (bhphotovideo.com best source) since they do cleaning. If it develoops into an issue down the road, you will have coverage. It should cost about $40 - in my opinion worth it on its own merits. They do include cleaning as part of the warranty.

Hope that helps.

[jcon]

Gene, I feel for ya man! Especially since youve been a great customer for Pana. You were the first to stick up for the noisy Z30 when nobody else would. I think they should be more willing to make you happy. My question for you is this, are you sure its a piece of something? It maybe a small "ding" or "dent" since you said it does not move. Maybe a cleaning would be good, I cant say, only you can but if it doesnt effect the photo quality it may not be worth it, I on the other hand need my things perfect and if there is any imperfection I have to have it fixed! Keep us posted on your decision and the outcomes!

[genece]

Nah what ever it is its inside the lens....Maybe a piece of seal or something it really is kind of shiney though.
It does not hurt the pictures but who knows where the next piece may show up.

[JMK]

I wouldn't trust Bigston to change a light bulb. They couldn't fix my FZ15 (see my previous posts). In my dealings with Panasonic and Bigston I found out that Panasonic just started out sourcing their repair work to Bigston at the beginning of this year, so they don't really have alot of experience fixing Panasonics stuff yet, and that Bigston will not give you a new camera. Panasonic is the only one that can do that.

So keep calling Panasonic; the Squeaky Wheel gets the grease.:)

[John_Reed]

But if you were running a business, would you just automatically give someone a new camera when they showed you what looked like an easily repairable fault? I mean, the repair technician might conclude after inspection that it IS a non-cleanable speck, or fault, and at that point either replace the lens element or the camera, whichever turns out to be cheaper. It just seems to me that "business sense" drives many of these kinds of dialogs, from the vendor's viewpoint. They probably have an established, written policy on just how to respond to queries like yours.

But frankly, if you don't trust Panasonic's service to turn around a timely repair for you, and the speck isn't causing any visible photo problems, it's probably best to let it ride, but watch it closely to see if it moves around.

[genece]

I am sure they agree with your reasoning John But I do not want someone opening my camera when there is a better option.. and they can then sell mine as refurbished it does not cost them much to keep a happy customer.
They just do not care.

And I probably will just wait and see what happens and I am sure that immediately after their long warranty(6 Months) expires I will have more spots.

As I said a great camera and poor customer service.

[John_Reed]

If you think that they "don't care" when they offer to inspect and repair (or possibly replace) it, I'm just putting my feet in their shoes, and wondering what else a customer could reasonably expect them to do? If you bought another brand of camera, do you think you'd be treated any better? Or worse? I certainly haven't heard anyone on this site heaping praises on anyone's customer service, for any camera brand.

I was trying to think of any other types of products where the seller would freely give a new replacement to the buyer based on a minor problem like this. Only diamonds came to mind, maybe there are others?

I'm sorry you've encountered this problem. Do you think it's a particle that came from inside the camera, or from outside the camera while you were using it?

[genece]

That again is my complaint it is clearly inside the camera , how could I have done that?
I am willing to take the blame if its my fault but I can not see how thats possible. ( it would not be the first thing I screwed up if it is my fault)
And I feel I should not have to do without a camera while they allow someone to practice repairing my camera. Leave them practice with Panasonics camera.
It is my guess you and I are the opposite ends of the retail business.

[jcon]

Gene, I am on your side with this issue, sorry John. If I were in your shoes I would keep calling and fighting to get it replaced. Yes, it may be very minor right now, now being the key word. Like you said, it very possibly could get worse. There is no way for you to tell where that particle came from, its obvious somewhere from inside the camera, which would kinde worry me! Gene, keep calling and hounding and threaten to take business elswhere, that always seems to work, especially when your a good customer!

[John_Reed]

It is my guess you and I are the opposite ends of the retail business.Gene, I've never been a seller of retail goods, but I do sell my services as a consultant. So I have to operate a business has survived now for 19 years by the fruits of my own labor and knowledge. But it is a business, so I appreciate the things a seller has to do to maintain some kind of liveable profit margin. What end of the retail business covers your experience?

[genece]

Absolutely none John ( maybe thats why I feel the way I do) the remark was kind of tongue in cheek ,I figured you in sales and me as a consumer.
I never understood or had any sympathy for big business, either as an employee or a consumer.
I guess I am getting away from the subject , but I still feel I am not being treated fairly.

[astro]

Gene, I am on your side with this issue, sorry John. If I were in your shoes I would keep calling and fighting to get it replaced. Yes, it may be very minor right now, now being the key word. Like you said, it very possibly could get worse. There is no way for you to tell where that particle came from, its obvious somewhere from inside the camera, which would kinde worry me! Gene, keep calling and hounding and threaten to take business elswhere, that always seems to work, especially when your a good customer!
Almost no camera company will replace your camera. All they will do is have you send it in and repair it - taking a month or two.
Canon, Nikon, Pentax, Olympus, Minolta, you name it.

[Honest Gaza]

Gene, as your concern appears to be "what if the probelm gets worse, once outside the warranty period"....perhaps you should try and seek some form of documented evidence that may be useful further down the track.

By this I mean take the Camera to Panasonic, or an authorised repair agent, and advise them that while the function of the camera does not appear to be affected at this stage, you would like some documented evidence from them that your concerns have been noted. That way, if the problem does worsen, you have a "paper-trail" as evidence of a previous fault.

May be worth exploring ????

[genece]

That pretty much was what I was after, to have a dialog with them but they had one answer, send it to Bigston digital service.
And I am not buying into no camera company would be fairer.
Seems as though it would not hurt them to try and understand, rather than tell you to ship the camera to some 3rd party.
It just is not satisfactory.
If I would have had this treatment with my FZ10 ..there would not have been any more Panasonics.

[John_Reed]

That "Bigston" outfit does all of Panasonic's repairs in the USA. Isn't it in Elgin, IL, which is the same place that my FZ30 was shipped from, when I bought it from Panasonic? There may not be any other US place that does repairs, with or without the Panasonic name on it. It seems to me that you need to give these guys a chance to make your camera right? That'd be my choice anyway. But suit yourself, it's your camera.

[genece]

John... Are you sure You are not the guy from Panasonic I was talking with. :)

Just kidding ...but you and I are not on the same page.

[StanStan]

I just have to do this as I feel Panasonic is not willing to treat me fairly.
I bought a FZ30 from Panasonic USA on the 2nd of Sept.
And I love the camera and I am sure most of you are tired of me telling you that.
But the camera has developed a foreign object inside the lens.
. I trimmed Gene's post

Gene:

I purchased a $1200 replacement/repair policy from my Homeowners insurance company for $24 per year covering the FZ20 and all accessories. Coverage for camera being stolen or dropped. Gives me peace of mind. My camera is covered for 'unusual' operation.

If the particle does not move you may buy a Pana '40 or DSLR in a year. If it does you are covered. Yes Pana should answer every communication.

I know it is a bummer!!!!

BTW I may wait for the '40 or DSLR in about a year.
From posts the images from the '20 are as good as the '30. The feature I miss is the extended zoom and the manual zoom

Stan

[Anex]

This is why I buy the extra in-store insurance - I live and die by it with all my other electronics from Radio shack (literally have saved thousands of dollars using them). I did the same for my Pana from Tristate, same for my Ipods from J&R Music World (had to have 1 replaced too so thank god I got it). I know it's a moot point to say such things now but sometimes it is worth paying more.

At any rate, I definitely feel for ya Gene, I've been on your end of the sh_it stick before, which is why I purchase such additional coverage policies, but unfortunately feelings do not typically equate to logical thought. A business is a business and there's no business that stays in business by just doing what you were asking. They should definitely be much more communicative then they have been but unless you get high enough, they will all give you the same spiel; send it to the repair shop - and it's unlikely you will get high enough to overturn that.

My suggestion, document it, send it in to be fixed, then stress test the hell out of it to ensure they didn't screw anything up. Unfortunately I see you left with little choice for it is extremely unlikely they will change policy for you. Again, I sympathesize and agree with you for the most part, but I run a business too so I know where they come from as well (granted I personally would be much more willing to keep you happy with my product - happy customers are quite frankly good for sales).

Anyways, best of luck to you...

[genece]

I just wanted to do an update on this, as some may want to consider what has happened.

I sent 2 letters to people at Panasonic and made 3 phone calls to others ...so far no response.

I changed my request to (would they stand behind the camera if this developed into something serious after the warranty expired) and I got no answer.

While I really like the FZ30 and hope it will last me untill something better comes along, I think its my last Panasonic anything.

I am in the process of getting a HDTV and I crossed Panasonic off that list also.

[tim11]

I can feel your frustration esp. on a recent purchase.
It's really unfair that it happens to you, considering you are [one of] the most loyal Panasonic users here.

[eastbluffs]

I am sorry, but I cannot believe that one teeny tiny speck of dust is really worth all this. You are very (possibly over) demanding.

Often cameras and lenses get through QC with focusing or other serious quality issues, but a tiny speck of dust that frankly could have been there from the start but didn't show in a photo due to lighting? I really don't see how that makes it a lemon.

As an electronics consumer, you have an option to purchase from stores that offer no-questions-asked returns within 7 to 30 days of purchase. If you're going to be this picky - you should probably go that route.

Also; you noticed this within the 30 day period that extended warranty companies require registration - did you spend the $35 or so to get one of those?

Sorry to poo poo all this, and disagree with so many who have sided with you on this, but they've offered to correct the issue. I suppose you have a right to spew complaints as you wish, but it sort of waters down those complainers with real issues about companies that are really screwing customers. :rolleyes:

[tim11]

eastbluffs, you have the right to disagree with all this, of course. Your disapproval could be put in kinder words though.
Cheers.

[jcon]

Everyone is entitled to its own opinion but I respectfully disagree with you eastbluff. As Tim said you couldve been a bit more respectful with your words. I noticed you called it a "spec of dust" well as Gene mentioned and described, its clearly not "dust". I also noticed you said it was probably there from the beginning, well if thats the case Gene obviously had nothing to do with the partical being there. It was, in your own words, there from the beginning and in my eyes and many others, should be replaced if the customer is unhappy, I may be wrong but I beleive Gene bought it directly from Pansonic, so they should be more willing to take care of someone that buys directly from them as aposed to someone else. I disagree with your opinions but as you should have, I disagreed with respect. Im still with ya on this one Gene!

[eastbluffs]

eastbluffs, you have the right to disagree with all this, of course. Your disapproval could be put in kinder words though.
Cheers.
Frankly; I got a little bent at the damaging title of this thread. The major players (Canon, Sony, etc) are the reason we've got such great choices and I just didn't see the appropriateness of the slam given the nature of the problem. I'm all for going after the "big companies" when they are abusive to us little guys - just didn't see that this was one of those times. Again, just my opinion.

I shall practice at doning wading boots more. Guess I did cut to the chase - that being that I not only disagree that its a big deal but that positive action is not being taken.

How about this ... "May I gently suggest that the poster take Panasonic up on their offer to look at the item, and this certianly does illustrate the value of those no-questions-asked return policies and relatively inexpensive extended warranties. It is so unfortunate that the poster's beyond that pesky 30 day limit for them, but it does provide a valuable lesson for all.".

Would something like that be more respectful and constructive?:)

[genece]

I feel much better now as someone from Pansonic did get in touch with me to discuss my problem.
And while I am not sure what is going to happen, Its very nice to know that someone from Panasonic does indeed care about the customer.
So whatever happens , I feel much better about dealing with Panasonic, and I am glad, as the FZ line of cameras meets my needs very well. :o

[JMK]

I'm glad to see that you got some attention from Panasonic. I encountered about the same thing from them with my FZ15, and I was so mad I could spit fire.
But they did make things right in the end. Panasonic is a big company and it takes time for things to filter down to the proper people. Thats why I always use the squeaky wheel approach in dealing with large companies. You put enough information in the system and something will fall out.:D

[meillana]

I feel much better now as someone from Pansonic did get in touch with me to discuss my problem.
And while I am not sure what is going to happen, Its very nice to know that someone from Panasonic does indeed care about the customer.
So whatever happens , I feel much better about dealing with Panasonic, and I am glad, as the FZ line of cameras meets my needs very well. :o

glad to hear things panned out well for you gene.
keep us posted. :)

[macduff2]

Gene, I am on your side with this issue, sorry John. If I were in your shoes I would keep calling and fighting to get it replaced. Yes, it may be very minor right now, now being the key word. Like you said, it very possibly could get worse. There is no way for you to tell where that particle came from, its obvious somewhere from inside the camera, which would kinde worry me! Gene, keep calling and hounding and threaten to take business elswhere, that always seems to work, especially when your a good customer!
Dear Sir.
e-mail from macduff to the Panasonic
Jim McCombie purchased an FZ30 from xxxxxxx in Port Alberni, after a few weeks of use macduff found about 5 specks of dust on the inside of the internal lens assembly,(2 large ones that can be seen on pictures at 100%) these can be clearly seen if you zoom the lens out and in, by using a flash light held at 45 degrees to the lens.
xxxxx will be forwarding the defective camera as macduff sees this as a Panasonic quality control problem. macduff would be very much appreciative if at all possible that the camera be replaced with an other unit which is not defective as the internal lens assembly is a sealed unit at the production line. Sir, please go to www.dpreview.com and in the side bar find forums, slide mouse to the right then scroll down until you find the panasonic forum, ( in the blank search box)) you can ( search this forum), then search by typing in lens dust or lens spots this will direct you to the problems, there you can check the posts that reflect the quality control. cheers and thank you for your time in this urgent matter at hand. macduff also has a FZ20 with no problems. thanks Seumas McCombie.
www.island.net/~macduff2 home of the original jimmy jig

[macduff2]

[QUOTE=genece]I just have to do this as I feel Panasonic is not willing to treat me fairly.
I bought a FZ30 from Panasonic USA on the 2nd of Sept.
And I love the camera and I am sure most of you are tired of me telling you that.
But the camera has developed a foreign object inside the lens.
Here is a photo showing the object inside the red circle it seems to be a piece of metal but it does not move. And while at this time it does not seem to show up in the photos I still think it should be taken care of.


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v463/genece/defectMedium.jpg

I had a photo of the lens showing a thin Hoya filter mounted and it clearly showed that the speck was not there on the 10th of Sept. but I have discarded that photo.

Here is the reply from Panasonic USA about the speck and I do not feel that is a good option as I am sure there are no parts available for repair as I have tried to purchase another lens hood and was told they will not be available until November.
I feel Panasonic should replace the camera but they refuse.
So while I was waiting for their 4/3rds camera , that has all changed.
Heres their Email reply to my request.

Thank you for your inquiry. We are unable to replace the model at this
time. The camera will have to be checked by our authorized service
technician. Please send your camera to the Independent Authorized Service
Center listed below.

Bigston Digital Service
1590 Touhy Avenue
Elk Grove Village, IL 60007
1-888-439-2676

Thank You,
Panasonic Consumer Support
Genece, macduff posted another reply in page 3 of this forum, here is the reply from Panasonic
Dear Mr. Macduff,

I have forwarded your information to our service department, as well as the Camera division head to advise them of your situation.

You should be hearing from either Panasonic directly or xxxxx from xxxxx very soon.

Thank you for your patience.





xxxx xxxxxxx

SENIOR ACCOUNT MANAGER

CONSUMER PRODUCTS DIVISION

Panasonic®Canada Inc.

xxxxxx Riverside Way

xxxxxxx B.C. V6W 1K8

Webpage: www.panasonic.ca

EMAIL: xxxxxxxx xxxx

PHONE: xxx 278 4211 EXT: 3229

FAX: xxx 278 5116

Partner’s Webpage:

https://partners.panasonic.ca



-----Original Message-----
From: jim macduff [mailto:macduff2@island.net]
Sent: Monday, October 17, 2005 12:00 PM
To: xxxxxxxx xxxxx
Subject: ref camera with dust on the inside lens



Sir, you should type in, in the blank find box, dust inside lens. for your information for quality control Jim McCombie's camera # is G5SS00182 R In www.dpreview.com all information on any camera is readily availble, thanks again Seumas McCombie

www.island.net/~macduff2 home of the original jimmy jig