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brandname
08-16-2005, 09:33 AM
Any other owners out there? Lets get into the nitty gritty of this camera. I like the 18-70 lense over the kit lense .

D70FAN
08-16-2005, 01:45 PM
Any other owners out there? Lets get into the nitty gritty of this camera. I like the 18-70 lense over the kit lense .

Then you may like the Sigma 18-125 even more, but for different reasons. I sold my 18-70 after buying the Sigma (over a year ago). For $270 you might want to give it a try.

I have a D70 but results should be similar (and maybe even better). ;)

brandname
08-16-2005, 06:21 PM
I also own the 70-300 nikkor which is pretty good. next i want to get the 60mm macro lense

brandname
08-17-2005, 09:24 AM
Looks like I like manual setting better. What ISO Fstop and shutter speed to you prefer? I like the S mode because it chooses the aperature for me. I know the smaller the F# the less light comes in and the smaller the iso the more light is used right? As for shutter speed I discovered indoors I can only go as high as 1/500 before it blacks out. To freeze a water fall what settings would you use?


Thanks for any help.

D70FAN
08-17-2005, 09:45 AM
I also own the 70-300 nikkor which is pretty good. next i want to get the 60mm macro lense

Then you must have the AF-D verison, or you got the one good G that Nikon made. My 70-300 G is a paperweight. ;)

brandname
08-17-2005, 10:43 AM
Yes george i got the AF-D version. I kinda like the softness for some reason. Reminds me of real film . :D

D70FAN
08-17-2005, 10:58 AM
Looks like I like manual setting better. What ISO Fstop and shutter speed to you prefer? I like the S mode because it chooses the aperature for me. I know the smaller the F# the less light comes in and the smaller the iso the more light is used right? As for shutter speed I discovered indoors I can only go as high as 1/500 before it blacks out. To freeze a water fall what settings would you use?


Thanks for any help.

- I think you will realize more control using aperture priority.

- The smaller the f number, the more light is allowed in, as this is really represented as f/A (focal length divided by Aperture). So for a given focal length in mm the smaller the aperture number, the larger the lens opening.

A 100mm lens at f/2.8 (100mm divided by 2.8) will allow twice as much light in than at f/5.6 (100mm divided by 5.6).

- The higher the ISO the more "sensitive" the digital sensor or film is to light. The aperture controls the "amount" of light available, and the shutter determins how much of that light is allowed to hit the sensor in a given amount of time, and how much motion is "stopped".

- In shutter priority mode, using flash, 1/500 is the limit of the flash sync. The Nikon D50 and 70 are unique in consumer dSLR's for this ability. Most only go to 1/250 sec. or less.

- For shooting a waterfall the faster, the better the stop-action, probably starting at about 1/250 sec. It depends on how far the water falls. If it's 10 feet it will be moving slower than at 50 feet, reaching full speed, at a falling distance, wherever terminal velocity is reached. Also water at the top of the falls will always be moving slower than just before the bottom.

You have a digital camera... so try several shots at different shutter speeds. Start at 1/250 sec. It's easier than weighing for average water weight and size and doing the math. ;) But if you are a stickler for precision and like getting wet...

http://hypertextbook.com/facts/JianHuang.shtml

Or here.

http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/airplane/termv.html

brandname
08-17-2005, 12:15 PM
Very nice info. I like this forum 10 fold over the nikonians website.

D70FAN
08-17-2005, 01:41 PM
Yes george i got the AF-D version. I kinda like the softness for some reason. Reminds me of real film . :D

That is definately the better of the Nikkor 70-300's. As I said before the G lens is junk, so you have chosen wisely.

nwpoland
08-17-2005, 01:49 PM
what about the sigma 18-200 as the primary lens? any thoughts?

D70FAN
08-17-2005, 01:59 PM
With my D50 and the 70-300 lense when I try to rotate the aperture on the actual lense It wont let me take pictures. Why is this?

Newer AF cameras control aperture, both automatic and manual, from the camera and there is no provision for mechanical setting (this is a good thing). Lenses designed for both new AF cameras and older completely manual cameras (like my old FE) have the sepearate aperture ring. Notice the red/orange marking on the aperture ring, and the lock switch so that the lens doesn't accidentely go to manual aperture setting (which will cause an ERR to appear in the aperture reading area of the info LCD).

If you use lenses with aperture rings, make sure that they are locked at the highest numerical setting.

brandname
08-17-2005, 02:15 PM
what about the sigma 18-200 as the primary lens? any thoughts?

From what I have read its supposed to be sharper than the 70-300 but I have a feeling once I learn more about photography and this camera I will be able to compete with that one.

brandname
08-17-2005, 02:16 PM
Newer AF cameras control aperture, both automatic and manual, from the camera and there is no provision for mechanical setting (this is a good thing). Lenses designed for both new AF cameras and older completely manual cameras (like my old FE) have the sepearate aperture ring. Notice the red/orange marking on the aperture ring, and the lock switch so that the lens doesn't accidentely go to manual aperture setting (which will cause an ERR to appear in the aperture reading area of the info LCD).

If you use lenses with aperture rings, make sure that they are locked at the highest numerical setting.


Lol, I just got back from the camera store and thats what the guy told me as well.

D70FAN
08-17-2005, 02:18 PM
what about the sigma 18-200 as the primary lens? any thoughts?

I have read nothing but good reports on the Sigma, and the comparison tests done a few months ago confirm that it is capable and has a large sweetspot. I considered changing from my 18-125, but it seems that I have a very good copy of this lens and I'm getting great results, so why change?

The extra range is still very tempting, but I'm looking at some of the professional, and prosumer, f2.8's right now, so it will have to wait. I have a 35mm f2 and 50mmf1.8 for shooting low light and portraits, so I'm just waiting for the right deal to come along.

I don't think you can go wrong with the Sigma 18-200 as a good, reasonable cost, everyday lens. It is certainly at least as good as having an 18-70 and a 70-200 consumer grade lens set (if not better).

D70FAN
08-17-2005, 02:24 PM
From what I have read its supposed to be sharper than the 70-300 but I have a feeling once I learn more about photography and this camera I will be able to compete with that one.

If you didn't already have the 18-70 DX and the 70-300 AF-D I might recommend trying the equally good Sigma 18-200.

But with that extra 100mm of reach you are probably positioned well for everyday shooting. The shooting limits on your 2 lens set is no worse than going to a single lens, and again the extra 100mm will come in handy.

Add a Nikkor 50mm f1.8 to your collection for low light and portrait use, and you should be good to go. Incidentally the 50 has an aperture ring as well. ;)

brandname
08-17-2005, 02:24 PM
George what is the advantage of having a 18-70 and 70-300 over having 1 lense that is 18-300? I was stuck without my telephoto on my first shoot because both didnt fit in my bag.

D70FAN
08-17-2005, 02:40 PM
George what is the advantage of having a 18-70 and 70-300 over having 1 lense that is 18-300? I was stuck without my telephoto on my first shoot because both didnt fit in my bag.

Well first of all if there was a decent 18-300 our there I would own it. At this point in time you can only get 18-200.

However... there is the Tamron 28-300 (which is the older base design for their 18-200). I had this lens for a while but it was a little too soft for my liking (as is their 18-200).

I have the Sigma 18-125 for just that reason (a little extra reach over the 18-70 DX) and it is a very good lens. Even with the overlap with your 70-300 you might want to check it out (about $270). The only real problem is vignetting at the extremes of focal length and aperture. Fortunately, I shoot 100% NEF now and the vignette control function in Nikon Capture works great. So problem solved. :)

ae86gtv16
06-20-2007, 02:04 AM
Newer AF cameras control aperture, both automatic and manual, from the camera and there is no provision for mechanical setting (this is a good thing). Lenses designed for both new AF cameras and older completely manual cameras (like my old FE) have the sepearate aperture ring. Notice the red/orange marking on the aperture ring, and the lock switch so that the lens doesn't accidentely go to manual aperture setting (which will cause an ERR to appear in the aperture reading area of the info LCD).

If you use lenses with aperture rings, make sure that they are locked at the highest numerical setting.

how can i use the maximum aperture constantly? i have a D50 with a 28-300mm with an aperture ring. thanks in advance

tcadwall
06-20-2007, 06:46 AM
1) lock your lens at min aperture (largest number) where it is red/orange like the quoted post.
2) Switch your camera to 'A' mode, and set the aperture with the wheel.

- obviously, if you have a variable aperture lens, then as you zoom, it will change with the lens limitations.

ae86gtv16
06-20-2007, 11:16 AM
1) lock your lens at min aperture (largest number) where it is red/orange like the quoted post.
2) Switch your camera to 'A' mode, and set the aperture with the wheel.

- obviously, if you have a variable aperture lens, then as you zoom, it will change with the lens limitations.


thanks tcadwall, i was afraid that it's not possible (on D50) to use the aperture ring to use f3.5 constantly all throughout.

i was playing around with my Tamron's (28-200mm f3.5-5.3 XR Di) aperture ring and was able to use f3.5 constantly using all manual settings, including manual focus, after making a little modification on the lens. It acted like a regular Ai lens. I guess i'll just take sample shots to get the right exposure i want.

tcadwall
06-20-2007, 11:58 AM
There is still some misunderstanding somewhere.

I am not sure how you can make an aperture go wider than what the lens can do. If you successfully made a lens "appear" to the camera to be different that is one thing, but unless you are re-designing the lens, I don't see how that could be an effective modification. IOW - have no idea how effectively doing that could be a minor change.

A lens is what it is, you might have a hack to fool a camera, but it isn't going to fool the end-result.

Prospero
06-20-2007, 01:43 PM
thanks tcadwall, i was afraid that it's not possible (on D50) to use the aperture ring to use f3.5 constantly all throughout.

i was playing around with my Tamron's (28-200mm f3.5-5.3 XR Di) aperture ring and was able to use f3.5 constantly using all manual settings, including manual focus, after making a little modification on the lens. It acted like a regular Ai lens. I guess i'll just take sample shots to get the right exposure i want.

Tcadwall is right, just leaving the apperture ring at f/3.5 does not mean that it really is f/3.5 at the long end. I can leave the apperture ring of my Sigma 70-300 at f/4 at 300 mm, but the apperture really does not get any wider than f/5.6 there.

The main reason for that is that the apperture of a lens is influenced not only by the size of the diaphragm , but also by the focal length of the lens. If you zoom in a lens, you decrease the amount of light entering the camera. Therefore, the effective apperture of a lens decreases.

The scaling on the apperture ring, however, is the same for all focal lenghts. It does not show the change of the effective apperture. Thus, it may seem that the lens is still at f/3.5, while in fact it is at f/5.6.

Bobbye
06-20-2007, 01:59 PM
I bought a Nikon D50 as I already had some good Nikon AF lenses. I have not been pleased with the quality of my photos. They were much better on my Nikon film camera. Someone told me that I would need to buy VR Nikkor lens (specific for digital with Vibration Reduction) - that this lens would make a huge difference. I bought the camera so I could use my old AF lenses. I would like your comment on this, please. Have you been satisfied with your old AF lenses? Or is it necessary to purchase the new lens?
Bobbye
twinston@earthlink.net

jcon
06-20-2007, 02:15 PM
Post some of your pictures and also state which lenses you are talking about.

Also, you dont "Need" to buy VR lenses, ofcourse they are nice but they arent necessary for excellent pictures.

The Nikon D50 is a wonderful camera, so dont be discouraged!

Bobbye
06-20-2007, 03:06 PM
I will take some new photos soon and post them. I was using the 70-210 Nikkor lens and I have always been so happy with this lens but just have not gotten to good results that I did with my film camera. I will do some test photos, maybe tomorrow. Bobbye

Prospero
06-20-2007, 04:41 PM
I will take some new photos soon and post them. I was using the 70-210 Nikkor lens and I have always been so happy with this lens but just have not gotten to good results that I did with my film camera. I will do some test photos, maybe tomorrow. Bobbye

From what I have heard the 70-210 is quite good. Apparantly it is still sought after on Ebay even though it has been discontinued. I read that in a review by Ken Rockwell, though, so I am not sure how much of that is true :) .

Perhaps a problem could be that you are a bit more critical than you were with film. With film, you would see the result after it has been printed (usually at smaller sizes than the typical computer screen). In that way a lot of imperfections or a lack of sharpness is hidden.

Generally speaking, if a lens could produce nice prints when you were shooting film, it can do the same now. On the other hand, it could be that you are suffering from internal reflections caused by the sensor (it reflects more than film; newer lenses have a coating to block the reflection).

ae86gtv16
06-21-2007, 01:55 AM
Tcadwall is right, just leaving the apperture ring at f/3.5 does not mean that it really is f/3.5 at the long end. I can leave the apperture ring of my Sigma 70-300 at f/4 at 300 mm, but the apperture really does not get any wider than f/5.6 there.

The main reason for that is that the apperture of a lens is influenced not only by the size of the diaphragm , but also by the focal length of the lens. If you zoom in a lens, you decrease the amount of light entering the camera. Therefore, the effective apperture of a lens decreases.

The scaling on the apperture ring, however, is the same for all focal lenghts. It does not show the change of the effective apperture. Thus, it may seem that the lens is still at f/3.5, while in fact it is at f/5.6.

how did you make the sigma work at f/4 at 300mm? i thought the aperture ring has to be set to the minimum aperture for it to work? I tried to move my tamron's aperture ring from f22 to any other setting and my D50 kept giving me a "FEE" on the LCD, even on manual setting i can't use it.


anyhow, when i tried to hack my lens, i was able to set the aperture ring at f3.5 and the LCD screen was displaying "F--" instead of "FEE". using manual mode (metering not available) and manual focus (AF not available), i took a picture at f3.5 and at f5.6 using the same shutter speed; the f3.5 setting was a lot brighter compared to f5.6. now if what you're saying is true, shouldn't both photos look exactly the same? i'm just wondering.

i'll try to take more photos for comparison and try to post a link here this weekend.

tcadwall
06-21-2007, 05:30 AM
i took a picture at f3.5 and at f5.6 using the same shutter speed; the f3.5 setting was a lot brighter compared to f5.6. now if what you're saying is true, shouldn't both photos look exactly the same? i'm just wondering.

what was your focal length? It was very likely that you were somewhere near the 28mm mark. If you do the same test at 300mm then you will see the same exposure... I would bet.

The lens is the limitation - not the camera. The lens is a variable aperture lens. You can pay much bigger $$ to get a zoom lens with a constant aperture. Your camera will (with no false hacks) correctly display max aperture for any focal length in that case.

tcadwall
06-21-2007, 05:37 AM
Bobbye,

I tend to speculate along the lines of prospero. We call it 'pixelpeeking'. If you are analyzing your photos on a computer screen, and zoom into 100% you will see all kinds of stuff that you never saw on your prints (unless you were printing absolutely huge prints off of the film)

You didn't specifically say that you were comparing prints from both cameras. I have a feeling that if you did that test, both bodies same subject same settings, you might even like the prints from the D50 more.

Prospero
06-21-2007, 06:09 AM
I used the Sigma 70-300 on my D50 in the same way as you did with the Tamron. That way I could make it work at f/4.

Except that in reality it was not f/4 at all. If you take a picture using the same shutter speed and ISO at f/4 at 70 mm and one at 300 mm, you find that there is one f-stop exposure difference between the two pictures.

Thus, it is f/5.6 at the long end, even though the aperture ring indicates f/4.
With the ring at f5.6 at the long end the picture will indeed look even darker, but that is because you are really at f/8 then.

Also, while the aperture ring gives f/22 as the mimimum apperture, it in fact can go as far as f/36 at the long end. Thus, all the indicated apperture values have shifted one f-stop in comparison to the wide end of the lens.

Bobbye
06-21-2007, 11:05 AM
Here are some test photos I want you to look at. I have a Sony digital with a Carl Zeiss lens and it take marvelous photos but I am not as pleased with my D50. I will say that this is only the second time I have used this camera and I have not got the book down to show me how to do settings. I need you all "experts" to tell me what I need to set my camera at to get the sharpest photos.

I have uploaded some attachments. 002 is set on F22, 003 is set on F11,
004 is set on F11, 005 is set on F22. They are too dark, just not good photos. Not nearly as good as from my Sony 707. Look forward to hearing from you as I am anxious to use this D50 and my Nikon lens 70-210. Bobbye

25742

ae86gtv16
06-21-2007, 11:39 AM
what was your focal length? It was very likely that you were somewhere near the 28mm mark. If you do the same test at 300mm then you will see the same exposure... I would bet.


I was actually at 300mm when i took both shots. That's why i'm a bit confused, i had to make the shutter faster for the f3.5 setting just to be able to darken the photo.

thanks for all the infos tcadwall, i'm just a hobbyist and i appreciate every info i gather from this forum.

ae86gtv16
06-21-2007, 11:49 AM
I used the Sigma 70-300 on my D50 in the same way as you did with the Tamron. That way I could make it work at f/4.

Except that in reality it was not f/4 at all. If you take a picture using the same shutter speed and ISO at f/4 at 70 mm and one at 300 mm, you find that there is one f-stop exposure difference between the two pictures.

Thus, it is f/5.6 at the long end, even though the aperture ring indicates f/4.
With the ring at f5.6 at the long end the picture will indeed look even darker, but that is because you are really at f/8 then.

Also, while the aperture ring gives f/22 as the mimimum apperture, it in fact can go as far as f/36 at the long end. Thus, all the indicated apperture values have shifted one f-stop in comparison to the wide end of the lens.

thanks for the info prospero.

have you tried taking pictures at 300mm at f5.6 and f4 using the same ISO and shutter speed? i'm just curious, from what you're telling me, you should get 2 pictures with the same exposure even though you used different f/stops for both.

thanks again.

tcadwall
06-21-2007, 11:58 AM
Bobbye,

- alright this is confusing having two sub-topics here! :)

Can I suggest something that might help you a lot? It is a book for the D50 by Thom Hogan... www.bythom.com (http://www.bythom.com) check out his site, and maybe buy that book. It will help you understand the camera more. It is going to take some practice to get the results you are aiming for I think. The camera AND lens are capable of better.

One of the few advantages that p&s cameras have are that their DOF is much larger. Of course, most of us don't find that an advantage, for instance do you really want the brick background in focus? or do you want focus to attract the eye to the flowers or the statues.

What I generally see here is that you

1) aren't used to the AF on this camera yet. The book would help with understanding which modes would help you the most, and how they work.

2) Exposure is not horrible in these shots (IMO) it is all about where the focus should lie. If you get a better handle on metering modes, and AF, then this will really help you. For instance, the over-all image - even in the f/11 statue shot - is a little dark. You can change this by setting the exposure compensation to your liking. OR you might be able to change your metering mode. IE if it is right now spot metering, then it seems that it metered appropriately for the statue. If it is matrix metering then change the exposure compensation. AGAIN, these would be explained MUCH better in Thoms book.

Not sure if this helps much, but let me recommend the D50 book by Thom Hogan...;)

tcadwall
06-21-2007, 12:01 PM
from what you're telling me, you should get 2 pictures with the same exposure even though you used different f/stops for both.


I know you were asking Prospero, but we are both saying the same thing I think. Yes, this is the expected result. I am confused as to how your results were different. Maybe there is something going on in your software that is auto leveling images or something? Or does it look that way on the histogram on-camera as well?

ae86gtv16
06-21-2007, 12:17 PM
I know you were asking Prospero, but we are both saying the same thing I think. Yes, this is the expected result. I am confused as to how your results were different. Maybe there is something going on in your software that is auto leveling images or something? Or does it look that way on the histogram on-camera as well?

the histogram for both pictures are different from each other. it also shows that the f3.5 is brighter than the f5.6 at the same focal length, shutter, and ISO.

i'll do more test shots this weekend and post the samples. thanks again for your comments tcadwall.

Prospero
06-21-2007, 12:17 PM
thanks for the info prospero.

have you tried taking pictures at 300mm at f5.6 and f4 using the same ISO and shutter speed? i'm just curious, from what you're telling me, you should get 2 pictures with the same exposure even though you used different f/stops for both.

thanks again.

Perhaps I was not really clear. What I meant to say was that the values on the apperture ring are simply not correct at the long end of the zoom. The real appertures are actually one stop smaller. So, having the lens at f/4 at 300 mm will give you an apperture of f/5.6, f/5.6 will give you f/8, f/8 will give you f/11, etc.

Thus, the exposure of these two will be different.

I did test all this and found the following
- f/4 at 70 mm was brightest,
- f/4 at 300 mm was one stop less bright,
- f/5.6 at 300 is one stop less bright than f/4 at 300mm.

tcadwall
06-21-2007, 12:23 PM
LOL - I totally was going off of the "assumed" comparison...

If you have your hacked lens showing a 'false' f/3.5, while @ 300mm, and you have your un-hacked lens (locked at min aperture and controlled by camera) showing f/5.6 - on the camera display(assuming that is the max aperture for that focal length) ALSO at 300mm

... and everything else set the same...

then you should be getting the same exposure.

What am I missing?

jcon
06-21-2007, 12:28 PM
Bobbye,

- alright this is confusing having two sub-topics here! :)




You are correct sir! :D

Bobbye, I agree they arent too badly underexposed. However, for me personally, I really dont see the need to shoot at F22. Most of the time F9 will suffice. I never go over F12.

I think the photos are a little soft, which could be a result of 2 things, soft lens, or bad focus. Since you said you havent used the camera much I would suggest you play with it and get used to the controls and options, after all, it dont cost anything to erase a bad picture;)

Prospero
06-21-2007, 12:31 PM
LOL - I totally was going off of the "assumed" comparison...

If you have your hacked lens showing a 'false' f/3.5, while @ 300mm, and you have your un-hacked lens (locked at min aperture and controlled by camera) showing f/5.6 - on the camera display(assuming that is the max aperture for that focal length) ALSO at 300mm

... and everything else set the same...

then you should be getting the same exposure.

What am I missing?

The only thing you are missing, or perhaps I misinterpreted the question of ae86, is that I kept the lens hacked for the f/5.6 picture. I selected f/5.6 with the apperture ring, not with the camera.

So, the values of the apperture ring are one f-stop to large at 300mm, but the camera automatically shows the correct apperture.

Thus, f/5.6 on a regular lens is the same as f/4 on the 'hacked' lens.

ae86gtv16
06-21-2007, 12:41 PM
The only thing you are missing, or perhaps I misinterpreted the question of ae86, is that I kept the lens hacked for the f/5.6 picture. I selected f/5.6 with the apperture ring, not with the camera.

So, the values of the apperture ring are one f-stop to large at 300mm, but the camera automatically shows the correct apperture.

Thus, f/5.6 on a regular lens is the same as f/4 on the 'hacked' lens.

on my D50, the camera doesn't show any apperture on the LCD at all, no matter where the ring is, it always display "F--". this is also the case when i use my vivitar (non-CPU) AI-S manual focus lens. and as i've said earlier, without the hack the display shows "FEE", and the camera won't even let me take pictures in any mode.

prospero, does your auto focus work when the lens is hacked?

thanks again.

tcadwall
06-21-2007, 12:43 PM
gotcha. So I guess both make sense.

Prospero
06-21-2007, 12:51 PM
on my D50, the camera doesn't show any apperture on the LCD at all, no matter where the ring is, it always display "F--". this is also the case when i use my vivitar (non-CPU) AI-S manual focus lens. and as i've said earlier, without the hack the display shows "FEE", and the camera won't even let me take pictures in any mode.

prospero, does your auto focus work when the lens is hacked?

thanks again.

No, autofocus does not work when hacked. Hacking in this case is turning the lens not far enough for all the contacts to connect, and thus autofocus does not work.

It makes sense that the AI-s lens only works in manual with the F-- thing in the display.
However, if the tamron is a autofocus lens, it should work when the apperture ring is (locked) at the minimum apperture. If it does not work in that way, it could be that the chip in the lens is outdated. You can get it rechipped by Tamron and then it should work.

ae86gtv16
06-21-2007, 01:09 PM
No, autofocus does not work when hacked. Hacking in this case is turning the lens not far enough for all the contacts to connect, and thus autofocus does not work.

It makes sense that the AI-s lens only works in manual with the F-- thing in the display.
However, if the tamron is a autofocus lens, it should work when the apperture ring is (locked) at the minimum apperture. If it does not work in that way, it could be that the chip in the lens is outdated. You can get it rechipped by Tamron and then it should work.


autofocus works on my tamron when using it unhacked and doesn't when hacked. my lens, hacked, is turned all the way (locked with the body). i'll take some photos at 300mm using hacked and unhacked lens at all the same setting.

thanks again for the infos. appreciate it much.

Bobbye
06-21-2007, 02:19 PM
Re my photos, today is very sunny, yet my photos turned out so dark and also they look not focused. I have used this lens many, many times on my film camera and with very good results. I am sure some changes in the settings are needed but with other digital cameras I have used, put it on automatic and you can get a fairly decent photo. I cannot see changing a few settings is going to make that much difference. Bobbye

jcon
06-21-2007, 03:13 PM
What mode are you using on the D50? Have you tried auto mode? Also, like I said before, dont use such high F numbers, that will make your picture much darker and will cause alot of other "bad" things to happen to the quality of the photo.

smartguy26
06-21-2007, 05:26 PM
i found a good deal on a d50, but its body only (this is to be expected)

so im wondering what lens i should get before i buy the camera
i dont want to spend more than $300, and i was considering:
sigma 18-125
nikon 18-70
nikon 18-135
any thoughts?

jcon
06-21-2007, 05:40 PM
i found a good deal on a d50, but its body only (this is to be expected)

so im wondering what lens i should get before i buy the camera
i dont want to spend more than $300, and i was considering:
sigma 18-125
nikon 18-70
nikon 18-135
any thoughts?

If this sounds rude I apologize thats not my intent...

Use the search feature. Those lenses have been discussed at lengths on this forum. Then if you still have questions about a particular lens, then we all would be glad to help. Also, we already have 2 totally different topics going in this single thread, anymore and it would get way to confusing and cluttered. I suggest start your own new thread if you have specific questions. That way you wont get lost in the shuffle.:)

Rooz
06-21-2007, 10:42 PM
If this sounds rude I apologize thats not my intent...

Use the search feature. Those lenses have been discussed at lengths on this forum. Then if you still have questions about a particular lens, then we all would be glad to help. Also, we already have 2 totally different topics going in this single thread, anymore and it would get way to confusing and cluttered. I suggest start your own new thread if you have specific questions. That way you wont get lost in the shuffle.:)

we need some stickies i reckon for those common lens questions.\
jeff...where are you.

Bobbye
06-22-2007, 05:57 AM
This photo was taken with "automatic". The background is dark and not too sharp. Bobbye

tcadwall
06-22-2007, 08:17 AM
Bobbye.

ok. How do I say this properly... Do you understand a histogram, or what I mentioned earlier. We all have our own taste when it comes to exposure. That is why the camera has exposure compensation, a preview screen, different metering modes, different color modes, ability to control exposure and depth of field by aperture, shutter, and ISO...

I look at the wagon photo and see the same thing. Middle of the day, hard shadows, and therefore a quite large dynamic range.

There are many things that you can do for this. Starting by reading some good tutorials, Thom Hogans eBook for the D50, Understanding Exposure, and several other good resources that you can borrow at your local library will help you get better results. You keep talking about film... I have hardly ever seen someone with a strong film background not understand the issues that you are proposing here.

Here are a few ideas that you might want to consider: Shoot these high dynamic range shots in raw mode. You can then bring out the shadows more if you would like. Change your color saturation modes / levels to see which you prefer - that might also help you out. But honestly, if you want to take a very sunny day, and fill in the shadows, then I suggest bouncing the light, or shading the brighter subjects, or using a fill flash, or....

The truth is that your D50 is a very capable camera. You can either choose to learn how to do the tough scenes (and yes, as simple as this composure might seem, what you are trying to get out of it regarding dynamic range - it is a tough scene) or switch back to your Sony when you need to get a more washed out shot that has larger depth of field.

The wagon would likely be quite over-exposed if you exposed for the shadows. A more advanced way of handling this would be to 1) shoot it raw, or 2) - even more advanced and time consuming shoot it bracketed (not sure what the D50 bracketing capabilities are) and use HDR techniques on it. The easier way would be to adjust your exposure compensation, or just decrease your shutter speed - depending on what "mode" you are shooting in.

ae86gtv16
06-23-2007, 10:52 PM
I know you were asking Prospero, but we are both saying the same thing I think. Yes, this is the expected result. I am confused as to how your results were different. Maybe there is something going on in your software that is auto leveling images or something? Or does it look that way on the histogram on-camera as well?

I just got the sample photo from using the hack and unhacked version of the lens. The hacked version use the aperture ring to set aperture and locked to the body of the camera.

All photos were taken using Manual mode, ISO 200, shutter @ 1/1.3, 300mm.

This photo was taken using an unhacked lens. The max aperture available is
f6.3. Shutter @ 1/1.3. ISO 200 @ 300mm. Metering @ 0. AF
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v435/apex4ag/Nikon%20D50%20Images/Misc/AF300mm63.jpg

This one was taken with a hacked lens. Aperture was set at f3.5 using the aperture ring. Shutter @ 1/1.3. ISO 200 @ 300mm. Metering N/A. MF
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v435/apex4ag/Nikon%20D50%20Images/Misc/MF300mm35.jpg

This one was taken with a hacked lens. Aperture was set at f5.6 using the aperture ring. Shutter @ 1/1.3. ISO 200 @ 300mm. Metering N/A. MF
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v435/apex4ag/Nikon%20D50%20Images/Misc/MF300mm56.jpg

This one was taken with a hacked lens. Aperture was set at f8 using the aperture ring. Shutter @ 1/1.3. ISO 200 @ 300mm. Metering N/A. MF
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v435/apex4ag/Nikon%20D50%20Images/Misc/MF300mm8.jpg

Now. Doesn't the 2nd photo looks brighter (over exposed) compare to the 1st photo which taken using the built-in meter. That's why I'm kind of getting confused because it seems that when the lens is hacked and the aperture ring is set to f3.5 @ 300mm, the actual opening is bigger than f6.3 (max aperture when lens is unhacked @ 300mm). :confused:

Prospero
06-24-2007, 05:32 AM
Now. Doesn't the 2nd photo looks brighter (over exposed) compare to the 1st photo which taken using the built-in meter. That's why I'm kind of getting confused because it seems that when the lens is hacked and the aperture ring is set to f3.5 @ 300mm, the actual opening is bigger than f6.3 (max aperture when lens is unhacked @ 300mm). :confused:

There is no exposure difference between the first and the second picture. The difference between the pictures is the white balance.

The second picture has a white balance that is a lot warmer than that of the first picture. This increases the saturation of some of the colours making them seem brighter.

If you correct the colours of the second picture to match those of the first, you will see that the pictures are almost exactly the same. Correcting the colours does not change anything to the exposure.

So, after you took the first picture, there was a huge shift in whitebalance causing the pictures to look so different. My guess about what caused this shift is that the camera doesn't do any metering with a hacked lens, so also no whitebalance metering, and therefore assumes the daylight whitebalance.
In the first picture the camera picked incandesent whitebalance, hence the difference.

ae86gtv16
06-24-2007, 12:53 PM
There is no exposure difference between the first and the second picture. The difference between the pictures is the white balance.

The second picture has a white balance that is a lot warmer than that of the first picture. This increases the saturation of some of the colours making them seem brighter.

If you correct the colours of the second picture to match those of the first, you will see that the pictures are almost exactly the same. Correcting the colours does not change anything to the exposure.

So, after you took the first picture, there was a huge shift in whitebalance causing the pictures to look so different. My guess about what caused this shift is that the camera doesn't do any metering with a hacked lens, so also no whitebalance metering, and therefore assumes the daylight whitebalance.
In the first picture the camera picked incandesent whitebalance, hence the difference.


Now it makes more sense. I'll try to fix the 2nd picture using lightroom. So since the hacked lens can't use the auto white balance it defaulted to daylight setting. I learned something new again. Thanks for the explanation prospero, appreciate it. :D

tcadwall
06-24-2007, 01:53 PM
Yup totally agree. I would have said the same thing..> First picture, white balance is correct.

ae86gtv16
06-26-2007, 01:47 AM
Has anyone heard about a petition for a firmware upgrade for the D50? I know I've read it somewhere, but I'm not sure if it is true or not. Just wondering.

K1W1
06-26-2007, 04:00 AM
Has anyone heard about a petition for a firmware upgrade for the D50? I know I've read it somewhere, but I'm not sure if it is true or not. Just wondering.

Why?
The D50 is now obsolete Nikon have no obligation legal, moral or otherwise to offer any sort of firmware upgrade. Any petition would fall completely flat on it's face and would only serve to upset people and cause arguments on sites like this. The D50 was (and may still be) by far the largest selling Nikon DSLR any Internet petition would be likely to generate a fraction of one percent of owners signing up and do you think Nikon would be concerned about what a fraction of one percent of owners of an obsolete camera think?
Besides all that I can't think of any reason to want to update the firmware in my D50 anyway.

ae86gtv16
06-29-2007, 12:09 PM
Why?
The D50 is now obsolete Nikon have no obligation legal, moral or otherwise to offer any sort of firmware upgrade. Any petition would fall completely flat on it's face and would only serve to upset people and cause arguments on sites like this. The D50 was (and may still be) by far the largest selling Nikon DSLR any Internet petition would be likely to generate a fraction of one percent of owners signing up and do you think Nikon would be concerned about what a fraction of one percent of owners of an obsolete camera think?
Besides all that I can't think of any reason to want to update the firmware in my D50 anyway.

I guess it's just wishful thinking for some D50 owners, it would be great if they can give us an update to be able to use SDHC cards.

Just in case anyone is interested to check the page, here it is http://www.petitiononline.com/nikond50/petition.html

K1W1
06-29-2007, 04:00 PM
I've got 3 x 1GB and 1 x 2GB cards that owe me a total of around $120. That will give me around 850 shots and probably mean I run out of battery before I run out of cards. Can't see the need for SDHC myself.

wh0128
06-30-2007, 11:08 AM
The thing is is that Nikon is done with the D50 and is moving on to a more consumer based DSLR like the D40(x) to appeal to everyone ($$$inexpensive).

The D40(x) and D80 have those features that the D50 does not because Nikon probably didn't feel the need to have for example, in camera processing of your photos.

The D50 is plenty enough of a camera to last a while and how hard is it to post-process those photos out of camera (Capture NX, PS, Bibble) than it is to do it in camera where you can barely see the actual result because of the 2.5" LCD.

ae86gtv16
07-01-2007, 02:52 PM
Does anybody know if the SB-20 will work with the D50/D80? Thanks in advance.